New here~ and a question

[jreeds]

Hi!

I thought about doing an intro but I have a question so I thought I'd just go for it. Been lurking for awhile, heard about this board from the MLGBCN.

6 year old DS SPD, GAD, currently going through multidisciplinary eval through school and a psychologist privately. Our IEP meeting to go over results is on the 21st. My issue now though is figuring out summer camp. Last year he was in preschool and the program extended through the summer except for the last week. For that last week we put him in the same camp as DD ( 8 years old, ADHD) and it was horrendous. Out of the 5 days he was there they called us to pick him up 3 days.

Now, we're a little further along in the process of figuring out a broader picture of what we're dealing with, with him. DD is attending the same camp this year and I'm hesitant to sign DS up. We obviously can't be getting calls to pick him up every day. The things that result in phone calls are him having meltdowns, sometimes being physical. During these meltdowns he circles the room and sometimes knocks things over ( trash cans, shelves etc). The problem is, I've looked for other options and there are just no camps in our area who seem to deal with these types of things. And again, I don't even know exactly what he is going to be diagnosed with but I would not be shocked to here ASD and/or ADHD/ADD. I've brought up the idea of hiring a nanny for him for the summer but he really needs the socialization piece that camp offers.

Any guidance or help would be appreciated. It may come down to waiting to see what the school says in their evaluation and seeing if there is some program that the school offers. I just don't know right now.

[akafred]

Do you mind sharing your general location? Just in case you are near any BTDT moms.

If you live near a special needs private school, some of them have summer camp programs. There is one near me in middle TN that is almost $40k a year so way out of reach, but their camps are a little more affordable and sometimes there are scholarships.

[jreeds]

Thanks!

I'm in NH

[mirandah]

Summer stuff is hard. You've gotta dig deep, and look outside the box. I feel like a lot of stuff isn't advertised very well. One summer I sent my son to a special needs camp. It was actually an overnight (!) week long camp for kids with ASD ages 6-12 (I can't imagine sending a 6yo overnight for a week!). The camp also ran a day camp concurrently for kids with specific disabilities- MR, Downs, CF, etc. I called and asked and they said no problem, I could sign him up for just a daily camp and he'd trek around with the overnighters. And they cut the cost way down, so it was a great option, but one that wasn't advertised.

You may want to ask your school district for suggestions. They may know of certain programs that are better able to serve a SN population, e.g. a certain YMCA or JCC. It sounds like your son really just needs someone who knows how to engage him, and not any elaborate accommodations. My son's best experience was at an ASD camp with low ratios where they kept the kids in age-specific areas. We attend a very large church that runs a mental health inpatient facility for youth and adults. It's in a nice suburban location with a swimming pool and lake access. They just opened up a day camp for SN kids. There's also a private social skills provider who offers "social skills camp" which is 6 hours a day with optional wraparound care for working parents.

I agree- I wouldn't want to do a nanny. Summers have great potential for kids to find new interests and friends. DS is 9 now and he does fine at a regular NT daycamp, but I like to change it up a bit and make sure he gets exposed to new groups. We're doing a summer-school type program (STEM based, so I don't have to tell him it's summer school!), with day camp wrap around care, and then a week of chess camp. The chess camp he's going to is run by our state's "school chess association" and their brochure had a lot of language about ADD/ADHD kids; we sent DS last year and he loved it, lots of fellow travelers!

A woman in our district's parent ASD FB group recently asked about what to do with her 12 year old ASD son who isn't yet able to stay home alone. This is the age I really worry about- there is so little available for high functioning kids. Someone suggested the district's community ed program; you can stack courses to cobble together a full day of Minecraft classes and whatnot, but it's a huge headache.

[jreeds]

Mar 10, 2017 14:10:14 GMT -5 mirandah said:

Summer stuff is hard. You've gotta dig deep, and look outside the box. I feel like a lot of stuff isn't advertised very well. One summer I sent my son to a special needs camp. It was actually an overnight (!) week long camp for kids with ASD ages 6-12 (I can't imagine sending a 6yo overnight for a week!). The camp also ran a day camp concurrently for kids with specific disabilities- MR, Downs, CF, etc. I called and asked and they said no problem, I could sign him up for just a daily camp and he'd trek around with the overnighters. And they cut the cost way down, so it was a great option, but one that wasn't advertised.

You may want to ask your school district for suggestions. They may know of certain programs that are better able to serve a SN population, e.g. a certain YMCA or JCC. It sounds like your son really just needs someone who knows how to engage him, and not any elaborate accommodations. My son's best experience was at an ASD camp with low ratios where they kept the kids in age-specific areas. We attend a very large church that runs a mental health inpatient facility for youth and adults. It's in a nice suburban location with a swimming pool and lake access. They just opened up a day camp for SN kids. There's also a private social skills provider who offers "social skills camp" which is 6 hours a day with optional wraparound care for working parents.

I agree- I wouldn't want to do a nanny. Summers have great potential for kids to find new interests and friends. DS is 9 now and he does fine at a regular NT daycamp, but I like to change it up a bit and make sure he gets exposed to new groups. We're doing a summer-school type program (STEM based, so I don't have to tell him it's summer school!), with day camp wrap around care, and then a week of chess camp. The chess camp he's going to is run by our state's "school chess association" and their brochure had a lot of language about ADD/ADHD kids; we sent DS last year and he loved it, lots of fellow travelers!

A woman in our district's parent ASD FB group recently asked about what to do with her 12 year old ASD son who isn't yet able to stay home alone. This is the age I really worry about- there is so little available for high functioning kids. Someone suggested the district's community ed program; you can stack courses to cobble together a full day of Minecraft classes and whatnot, but it's a huge headache.

Thanks! I'm going to be making some calls this week. The boys & girls club DD is going to I believe has a program that might work. But it looks like we'd have to have DS followed by one of their behaviorists? I'm going to ask how that works. I've looked at some of the specialty camps and the hours don't work, most don't start til 9 and we work before that. I got a name for the student services person at the school and I'm going to call her too.

[mrsbuttinski]

Welcome.

You've already gotten some great advice from mirandah, and akafred, My kid's an adult, but we did camp for years. DS has an ASD (Aspergers type subsumes SPD), ADHD, GAD and is a repaired dyslexic. I have also been an adult volunteer scouter with a host of kids with developmental and behavioral dxs on weekend trips and on summer residence camp.

IME, the key strategy for success for early camp experiences is to add one more layer of support than they require to be successful at school. Because camp is less structured by design and because staff is almost always nowhere near as well qualified as teachers, you need to add a layer to set them up to be successful. IRL, this could mean providing a para at a mainstream camp or sending him to a camp that is more therapeutic in nature.

What's his current classroom placement? Was the school's MFE triggered by additional behaviors/not thriving in school with his current placement despite accommodations already in place?

Some thoughts.

1. If the eval comes back with ASD/ADHD, you might be able to get ESY in place. Can you document regression or lost skills over summer breaks?

2. DS started by attending half day special interest camps at your son's age. I didn't need child care, but this could be arranged by adding a PT nanny. He enjoyed Lenape camp, Lego and K'Nex camp, nature camp.These tended to be run by educated adults- teachers and naturalists- rather than high school students.

3. There may be SN camps and programs in your community that you don't know about. These places don't tend to advertise, they get referrals through word or mouth, support groups, psychologists, teachers. Sometimes these are at therapeutic schoools, but often they're run within some other camp program. Even without an ASD dx, a "social skills" camp that focuses on this plus self regulation when upset could be a good fit assuming the kids are a more high functioning group. The local Y or JCC might have an embedded program avilable.

4. Kudos to you for giving your DD her own camp experience. It can be hard for an older kid to be called upon to deal with behavior when teachers/counselors can't. BTDT. Plus, if your DS has inappropriate behavior, it allows her to not be associated.

5. There are resident camps for kids with special needs. Kids almost always have to travel to these. They are generally staffed by adults with special education backgrounds- sped teachers, OTs, PTs, APE instructors and SLPs. They're $$$ but can grow a kid in ways other programs can't.

6. Over time it will likely get better. DS has done all manner of camping and summer camp programs successfully and with reduce to no supports at all. Help him get the skills to be success in socially intensive and less structured settings in a more nurturing camp/school and then you will be able to drop supports as he matures.

[jreeds]

Mar 12, 2017 7:25:06 GMT -5 mrsbuttinski said:

Welcome.

You've already gotten some great advice from mirandah , and akafred , My kid's an adult, but we did camp for years. DS has an ASD (Aspergers type subsumes SPD), ADHD, GAD and is a repaired dyslexic. I have also been an adult volunteer scouter with a host of kids with developmental and behavioral dxs on weekend trips and on summer residence camp.

IME, the key strategy for success for early camp experiences is to add one more layer of support than they require to be successful at school. Because camp is less structured by design and because staff is almost always nowhere near as well qualified as teachers, you need to add a layer to set them up to be successful. IRL, this could mean providing a para at a mainstream camp or sending him to a camp that is more therapeutic in nature.

What's his current classroom placement? Was the school's MFE triggered by additional behaviors/not thriving in school with his current placement despite accommodations already in place? He started the school year with a 504 plan to accommodate SPD and GAD. Sensory breaks every 1-2 hours or as needed, Adaptive PE, early notification of fire drills and individual time with OT to work on fine motor ( his grip is a work in progress even now). Yes, the MFE was triggered because even with all that he was showing rigid behavior, increased anxiety. Sensory breaks were increasing and it was taking him longer to settle back down. Several instances where he spent an afternoon lapping the school halls with the guidance counselor in an effort to calm him to a point where he was able to process. They think a lot of it was triggered by the increased expectations of curriculum and a change in the order of the specials (music, PE, art) after holiday break.

Some thoughts.

1. If the eval comes back with ASD/ADHD, you might be able to get ESY in place. Can you document regression or lost skills over summer breaks? This is on my list of requests. It's hard, because this would be his first summer where he gets an actual break. The summer between Pre-K and K he stayed in his same pre K class because that is how that community center runs their program. His current teacher has noted though, that it's a major concern of theirs that he will lose all progress over the summer and especially with changing classes, teachers etc it will be like starting from square one with him.

2. DS started by attending half day special interest camps at your son's age. I didn't need child care, but this could be arranged by adding a PT nanny. He enjoyed Lenape camp, Lego and K'Nex camp, nature camp.These tended to be run by educated adults- teachers and naturalists- rather than high school students. I will look into these options for our area.

3. There may be SN camps and programs in your community that you don't know about. These places don't tend to advertise, they get referrals through word or mouth, support groups, psychologists, teachers. Sometimes these are at therapeutic schoools, but often they're run within some other camp program. Even without an ASD dx, a "social skills" camp that focuses on this plus self regulation when upset could be a good fit assuming the kids are a more high functioning group. The local Y or JCC might have an embedded program available. I think our boys & girls club does something like this working in conjunction with a behavioral health clinic in our area. Last summer when DS spent the week there the camp referred us to the clinic because unless he was being followed by that program they could not keep him. He was seen by the behavioral health clinic for 2 months then they dropped him siting not being able to work with him ( well duh, that is the whole problem). I'm about 90% sure the school has a program we might be able to get him into but I've been getting the runaround as far as who I need to talk to, to get him in.

4. Kudos to you for giving your DD her own camp experience. It can be hard for an older kid to be called upon to deal with behavior when teachers/counselors can't. BTDT. Plus, if your DS has inappropriate behavior, it allows her to not be associated. Thank you for that.One of the hardest things in dealing with all this is seeing how it's starting to effect DD. Too often in dealing with his behaviors I feel like we've expected her to be more understanding than her age allows. KWIM? Camp is an escape for her and I feel lucky we're able to do that.

5. There are resident camps for kids with special needs. Kids almost always have to travel to these. They are generally staffed by adults with special education backgrounds- sped teachers, OTs, PTs, APE instructors and SLPs. They're $$$ but can grow a kid in ways other programs can't. Not ruling this out but I can say with 100% assuredness that H would not be on board with this. He has been reluctant, to say the least, to acknowledge how extensive this is going to be for us.

6. Over time it will likely get better. DS has done all manner of camping and summer camp programs successfully and with reduce to no supports at all. Help him get the skills to be success in socially intensive and less structured settings in a more nurturing camp/school and then you will be able to drop supports as he matures. Thank you for your input, I was hoping you would respond.

[mrsbuttinski]

Mar 17, 2017 9:13:03 GMT -5 jreeds said:

Mar 12, 2017 7:25:06 GMT -5 mrsbuttinski said:

Welcome.

You've already gotten some great advice from mirandah , and akafred , My kid's an adult, but we did camp for years. DS has an ASD (Aspergers type subsumes SPD), ADHD, GAD and is a repaired dyslexic. I have also been an adult volunteer scouter with a host of kids with developmental and behavioral dxs on weekend trips and on summer residence camp.

IME, the key strategy for success for early camp experiences is to add one more layer of support than they require to be successful at school. Because camp is less structured by design and because staff is almost always nowhere near as well qualified as teachers, you need to add a layer to set them up to be successful. IRL, this could mean providing a para at a mainstream camp or sending him to a camp that is more therapeutic in nature.

What's his current classroom placement? Was the school's MFE triggered by additional behaviors/not thriving in school with his current placement despite accommodations already in place? He started the school year with a 504 plan to accommodate SPD and GAD. Sensory breaks every 1-2 hours or as needed, Adaptive PE, early notification of fire drills and individual time with OT to work on fine motor ( his grip is a work in progress even now). Yes, the MFE was triggered because even with all that he was showing rigid behavior, increased anxiety. Sensory breaks were increasing and it was taking him longer to settle back down. Several instances where he spent an afternoon lapping the school halls with the guidance counselor in an effort to calm him to a point where he was able to process. They think a lot of it was triggered by the increased expectations of curriculum and a change in the order of the specials (music, PE, art) after holiday break.

Some thoughts.

1. If the eval comes back with ASD/ADHD, you might be able to get ESY in place. Can you document regression or lost skills over summer breaks? This is on my list of requests. It's hard, because this would be his first summer where he gets an actual break. The summer between Pre-K and K he stayed in his same pre K class because that is how that community center runs their program. His current teacher has noted though, that it's a major concern of theirs that he will lose all progress over the summer and especially with changing classes, teachers etc it will be like starting from square one with him.

You can probably leverage his poor transition after the holiday break (last paragraph) as proof he will regress over the summer. That's a clear "regression and recoupment" situation under IDEA which is one of the easier ones to advocate around. DS qualified in elementary under "emerging skills' which might also apply here. 


www.wrightslaw.com/info/esy.index.htm






2. DS started by attending half day special interest camps at your son's age. I didn't need child care, but this could be arranged by adding a PT nanny. He enjoyed Lenape camp, Lego and K'Nex camp, nature camp.These tended to be run by educated adults- teachers and naturalists- rather than high school students. I will look into these options for our area.

3. There may be SN camps and programs in your community that you don't know about. These places don't tend to advertise, they get referrals through word or mouth, support groups, psychologists, teachers. Sometimes these are at therapeutic schoools, but often they're run within some other camp program. Even without an ASD dx, a "social skills" camp that focuses on this plus self regulation when upset could be a good fit assuming the kids are a more high functioning group. The local Y or JCC might have an embedded program available. I think our boys & girls club does something like this working in conjunction with a behavioral health clinic in our area. Last summer when DS spent the week there the camp referred us to the clinic because unless he was being followed by that program they could not keep him. He was seen by the behavioral health clinic for 2 months then they dropped him siting not being able to work with him ( well duh, that is the whole problem). I'm about 90% sure the school has a program we might be able to get him into but I've been getting the runaround as far as who I need to talk to, to get him in.


Sometimes behavioral health settings are designed for children with mental or behavioral  health concerns (like conduct disorder disorder, ADHD or bipolar) and aren't appropriate for children with developmental disorders like ASD or LD). The discipline plans in place can exacerbate behaviors, especially around those driven by anxiety. Plus, the kids of kids who are served in such programs often prey on those who are different- it's like giving them the perfect victim on which they can take out their own frustrations. 

4. Kudos to you for giving your DD her own camp experience. It can be hard for an older kid to be called upon to deal with behavior when teachers/counselors can't. BTDT. Plus, if your DS has inappropriate behavior, it allows her to not be associated. Thank you for that.One of the hardest things in dealing with all this is seeing how it's starting to effect DD. Too often in dealing with his behaviors I feel like we've expected her to be more understanding than her age allows. KWIM? Camp is an escape for her and I feel lucky we're able to do that.

5. There are resident camps for kids with special needs. Kids almost always have to travel to these. They are generally staffed by adults with special education backgrounds- sped teachers, OTs, PTs, APE instructors and SLPs. They're $$$ but can grow a kid in ways other programs can't. Not ruling this out but I can say with 100% assuredness that H would not be on board with this. He has been reluctant, to say the least, to acknowledge how extensive this is going to be for us.

Keep your DH in the loop. Make sure you expose him to DS in the context of his same aged male peers- have him take DS to places like T-ball, Cub Scouts, birthday parties. It'll knock the scales from his eyes which should result in a full partner as advocate. FWIW, we didn't do solo sleep away camp until DS was about 8 or 9. He did do Cub Scout camp with DH like the other boys from our pack. 

6. Over time it will likely get better. DS has done all manner of camping and summer camp programs successfully and with reduce to no supports at all. Help him get the skills to be success in socially intensive and less structured settings in a more nurturing camp/school and then you will be able to drop supports as he matures. Thank you for your input, I was hoping you would respond.

Thanks.