I missed what happened, but I do suddenly feel much more guarded, which is saying a lot, since I only posted the really personal stuff on the confidential board.
I only had one suggestion about the PPD board and that was to maybe rename it to better imply that it's for all forms of perinatal depressions? But that's just me. It's probably a dumb suggestion.
Post by lovegrilledcheese on Jun 2, 2015 21:04:14 GMT -5
This is my first post and I have thought about joining in but have always been a little to nervous to join in. If this board changes to having a password I think that would help me feel more comfortable posting things and if members agree to following a set of guidelines. I really like how you guise how discussing this.
******Loss Mentioned***** Me-Stage 3 Endo DH-MFI Nov and Dec 2014-Letrozole+trigger+IUI=BFN Jan 2015: IVF#1:ET cancelled due to severe OHSS FET #1: April 2015=BFP 4/10 & M/C 4/27 & D&C 5/15 Hysteroscopy and polypectomy 7/31 FET #2: Aug-Cxl FET #2.1 9/18-BFFN FET #3: 10/23-
This may be a dumb question since there are so many question marks out there on privacy, guidelines, etc... Should we continue with our checkins or wait until we get some of this hammered out?
This may be a dumb question since there are so many question marks out there on privacy, guidelines, etc... Should we continue with our checkins or wait until we get some of this hammered out?
I think that it is up to those currently participating in the check-ins. If you're comfortable posting, then by all means do so. Personally, I don't think it would be help further discussions if the regular board activities completely stopped.
Here's a question - I know the current breach was not malicious, but what if someone within the private community DOES maliciously use information within the private boards to attack a user elsewhere, whether on this site or even outside of TCF.
Are there protections in place? Could we get NariaDreaming in on this - what would happen to a user that maliciously used private health information to attack or discredit a member? Would this fall under the 'major attacks'/trolling and be an insta-site ban? Are the owners/administrators willing and able to help this community stay as safe and private as possible?
I remember that *other* place and how it was no holds barred during a smear campaign/callout. Things from the past were brought up, regardless of how private they were. I could not imagine what could have been used if there was an active MW board over there. I know we don't really do callouts on this site, but in case the day ever comes, it would be nice to know that information brought up on MW, especially on private boards, are completely off limits and using it as ammo would have consequences. Is this possible?
** I am talking exclusively about people that use information to actually attack/destroy/discredit someone here or off TCF. I am not referring to scenarios where a member is displaying potentially dangerous thoughts/actions and a member or group of members decides that authorities need to be contacted to check on their welfare. That is an entirely different situation. **
My gut reaction is yes, that would fall under malicious attack & trolling. I obviously would want to get input from wordsy & theo, but especially in the case of a password protected board, using someone's health history to attack is not OK.
5 years TTC 2 c/p's 2 failed IUIs/1 cancelled IVF 1 failed IVF 1 failed FET BFP 12/1/15. We said goodbye to Tiny 1/4/16 Fresh cycle #3 2/16 8R/7M/5F BFP 5/12/16 We said goodbye to flutter on 5/27 and poprock on 5/28 BFP 8/30/16 We said goodbye to Samuel 10/3 (Trisomy 16) Moving on to Donor Embryos BFP 12/20/16 We said goodbye to Turtle 12/30
I think we also have to agree that this won't be solved in one go. As the board grow and culture changes we will find the need for new rules or even the need to disregard old rules. I think we should try to find a short list of basic rules we can all agree on such as trigger warnings, disable siggies for certain post if it has a trigger item in it, and not sharing what is discussed here. I personally think a Mod should handle the password distribution.
Second thought: Is there anyway that proboards can make it so that our passwords that we use to check-in gives us access? That way we would only need right to the sub-boards and not have to worry about password distribution? Does this question makes sense
Edited because I didn't read all the way. Admins were tagged in.
Not being part of the private board: What is the rationale for a changing password? Content stays posted so you aren't locking old content as confidential, right? And I'm Guess the same people request the password each week. Curious as it might help formulate ideas that would accommodate this.
I am the gate keeper to the dads private board. Our policy is such that if you are a regular you're in. If not we ask you to post an intro or PM me your intro (so no one ever has to know you are even posting) and why you feel the board would be helpful. We feel that is a sufficient vetting process for our needs. The intro happens just in a confidential way that most would do once "inside" anyway.
We deal with similar concerns as here. Some of us have IRLers (wives) on other boards and have a desire to keep things private. We crafted a mission statement of sorts that implies the use of the password is your agreement to abide by our rules (which are fluid). It gets sent in a PM to the person along with the password. We can't promise 100% confidentiality unless everyone does their part so we charge folks to give what they want to receive.
If we go mod route I'd be happy to share it with that individual.
Two mods (various issues can be a trigger to one mod, someone may be having a bad day,,,etc) malicious disclosure of private information will result in a ban (Does this also mean repeated accidental disclosures will be a ban? I think so because enough "accidents" will lead anyone to belief it's not an accident anymore"
As stated this does not refer to: not referring to scenarios where a member is displaying potentially dangerous thoughts/actions and a member or group of members decides that authorities need to be contacted to check on their welfare. That is an entirely different situation.
I think this is a good framework for moving forward. This single thread won't solve all of the problems BUT I think a lot can be done with this.
Am I missing anything?
We need to include that the use of trigger warnings is extremely important on this board. I'd also like to suggest that posters turn off siggies while on this board regardless of what thread they are in,just as an extra precaution.
Two mods (various issues can be a trigger to one mod, someone may be having a bad day,,,etc) malicious disclosure of private information will result in a ban (Does this also mean repeated accidental disclosures will be a ban? I think so because enough "accidents" will lead anyone to belief it's not an accident anymore"
As stated this does not refer to: not referring to scenarios where a member is displaying potentially dangerous thoughts/actions and a member or group of members decides that authorities need to be contacted to check on their welfare. That is an entirely different situation.
I think this is a good framework for moving forward. This single thread won't solve all of the problems BUT I think a lot can be done with this.
Am I missing anything?
I think even "accidental" disclosures should result in at least a suspension of sorts. People need to think before they post. And repeatedly doing so should result in a ban from the private board. I know I'm totally biased here because in all my years on TD/TCF only one time did I ever mention the issue that was later thrown in my face for everyone to see and know about. I will talk about my schizophrenia openly, but that issue is private to me and I don't like to share with anyone that I don't truly trust will respect that information. It felt extremely malicious to me, but I see no one else seems to feel that way so I'm still uncertain if I will continue to use this board or not.
As for check-ins, I agree that they should continue. Even if people are a bit more guarded in what they say, they're good to have.
To echo juliayadda, i'd also like to thank @led, @pineappleoranges, tjr42px, and juliayadda for their contributions to the conversation,as well as their assistance in bringing the different issues that this board is currently facing out into the open.
Also, thank you to everyone else who has voiced their thoughts and concerns about the current state of the board. Everyone's input has been extremely helpful to identify the needs of this board.
Additionally, I wanted to suggest keeping the thread open until atleast Friday to give more people a chance to read through and add in any concerns that we have not covered yet. After Friday, we can determine what steps to take next.
I have a general question with regard to a board like this. It was commented that any posts pertaining to harm to self or of a Tarasoff nature would be grounds for breaching group confidentiality. NariaDreaming, theophania, wordsy - does Proboards have an official comment/practice with regard to this? Unless we actually know the user's personal info can we really make a claim that local authorities might be notified? Even an IP can be of little help. Not to be a downer but I know first hand, individuals who have made attempts with the belief they would be rescued by emergency personnel. Can we make the assertion that help is actually on the way? I think there is a morale humanity in wanting to say this is true, but to make it a group rule that can't be enforced/followed through with may be more detrimental. Hopefully this community will not have to face such a situation in that we can support one another in a preventative way, but it never hurts to understand our limits before we are pressed up against them.
I have a general question with regard to a board like this. It was commented that any posts pertaining to harm to self or of a Tarasoff nature would be grounds for breaching group confidentiality. NariaDreaming, theophania, wordsy - does Proboards have an official comment/practice with regard to this? Unless we actually know the user's personal info can we really make a claim that local authorities might be notified? Even an IP can be of little help. Not to be a downer but I know first hand, individuals who have made attempts with the belief they would be rescued by emergency personnel. Can we make the assertion that help is actually on the way? I think there is a morale humanity in wanting to say this is true, but to make it a group rule that can't be enforced/followed through with may be more detrimental. Hopefully this community will not have to face such a situation in that we can support one another in a preventative way, but it never hurts to understand our limits before we are pressed up against them.
Admins do have the ability to see things like registered email address, which can sometimes be of help. And IP addresses can be useful, though not always.
There is no guarantee we can find a user's Identity and Contact the police in time, but I will say that we would make our best effort to do so.
5 years TTC 2 c/p's 2 failed IUIs/1 cancelled IVF 1 failed IVF 1 failed FET BFP 12/1/15. We said goodbye to Tiny 1/4/16 Fresh cycle #3 2/16 8R/7M/5F BFP 5/12/16 We said goodbye to flutter on 5/27 and poprock on 5/28 BFP 8/30/16 We said goodbye to Samuel 10/3 (Trisomy 16) Moving on to Donor Embryos BFP 12/20/16 We said goodbye to Turtle 12/30
Post by runnergirl812 on Jun 3, 2015 21:21:49 GMT -5
There's been a lot of good suggestions in this thread. I will come out and say, I still feel the same about MW as I did before. I guess I realize with any online there is no way to ensure 100% anonymity. If people are uneasy, I think with time, they may feel comfortable to post... Or not. And that's okay. This is one board where I feel like someone might gain insight or encouragement just from lurking.
TBS, I will do my part and try to stay on top of Thankful Thursday. I feel like that was a good suggestion made by someone else, and for those who participate, it's good.
I hope people can come to some semblance of peace about all of this despite the betrayal and hurt. It may take time, but I'm hopeful. This board is of value and for issues like mental wellness, I am glad to be here. Anyway, great suggestions by everyone and I look forward to moving forward.
I have a general question with regard to a board like this. It was commented that any posts pertaining to harm to self or of a Tarasoff nature would be grounds for breaching group confidentiality. NariaDreaming, theophania, wordsy - does Proboards have an official comment/practice with regard to this? Unless we actually know the user's personal info can we really make a claim that local authorities might be notified? Even an IP can be of little help. Not to be a downer but I know first hand, individuals who have made attempts with the belief they would be rescued by emergency personnel. Can we make the assertion that help is actually on the way? I think there is a morale humanity in wanting to say this is true, but to make it a group rule that can't be enforced/followed through with may be more detrimental. Hopefully this community will not have to face such a situation in that we can support one another in a preventative way, but it never hurts to understand our limits before we are pressed up against them.
Admins do have the ability to see things like registered email address, which can sometimes be of help. And IP addresses can be useful, though not always.
There is no guarantee we can find a user's Identity and Contact the police in time, but I will say that we would make our best effort to do so.
Hi all. I read through this tread today and just wanted to let you know I haven't been posting lately just because I haven't had time, not because I've been avoiding the board. I think my frame of mind is similar to runnergirl's, I know nothing is 100% anonymous and I share what I'm comfortable sharing. I think whatever you guys decide about privacy rules will be fine by me. I am very sorry to see our little board going through this.
Post by motownthrowdown on Jun 4, 2015 10:07:59 GMT -5
I'm a newbie to this board but I would find a sticky on trigger warnings to be very helpful. I'm not super familiar with them in general but it seems like it would be a good idea to have a triggers 101 explanation just to help everyone out.
Well hi...I figure since I was someone who was "called out" on another board about my participation here I should probably comment eventually.
I haven't posted here in a month. I was struggling to relate to a lot of posters while I am going through IF treatments, even though I know others on here are as well. I felt like I couldn't add anything of value to anyone talking about parenting/pregnancy stuff and I just kept feeling sad.
I started to feel triggered by others' posts on here. I looked at that as a reflection on ME and who I am and where I'm at. I decided I was feeling more triggered than I was feeling better about myself/supported so I was stepping back.
There were some specific posts that I found to be insensitive and that's when I fully removed myself.
I never came on here thinking my posts were private, but being that they were from April and earlier, they were pretty buried by the time my participation was called out so I doubt anyone looking for my recent posts was going to be digging that far back.
I do agree, even if something's "public", what's posted here needs to stay here. It's not something I thought about before, it seemed kind of obvious to me I guess.
The trigger warnings....well, it's a MW board. I think there are a lot of potential triggers discussed here and I don't really know how those will work.
For me, I got hit hard with 2 people posting BFPs without warnings in a checkin thread - since they were both people posting about the struggle of TTC I just wasn't expecting a casual mention of it.
But I don't really know how you draw hard rules on that. What if I'm triggered by polka dots? If I'm feeling guilty, ugly, stupid, sad, do I need a trigger warning to talk about that on a MW board?
Are we supposed to go nuts with the check ins and divide them into really specific areas? I don't really want to be alienating each other in that way.
I'm also still not clear on how the private board works as far as not alienating others.
I think you have a solid point with the trigger warnings. The range of triggers is much broader than you would find on the other boards. You're also right that splitting up the main board check-ins could be really different since we are already a very small group.
Regardless, it would still be good to take cue from other boards and request that everyone be more conscientious about posting warnings about potentially triggering topics. I feel terrible that you felt so uncomfortable posting here because of a lack of warning from others. I hope that you will come back to the board when we put new guidelines in place.
By any chance, do you know if other boards have a list of topics that require trigger warnings?
...FWIW I think it would asking a lot/silly/potentially alienating to put a warning every time someone talks about their kids or pregnancy here.
Very true. Sometimes a person may only make a slight mention of kids or pregnancy, but have the main focus of the post be about something completely different in their lives. Or if someone new comes onto the board they could be too nervous to talk if they are met by a page full of ****trigger warnings****.
I do think going forward it would be helpful for initial announcements, like BFPs, losses, and other potentially sensitive situations. However, if someone is actively participating in the weekly check-in and gets a BFP, there wouldn't be a need for them to include a trigger warning every week after the inital announcement because it becomes expected they might mention it in their check-in.
Post by snarkysparklefart on Jun 5, 2015 10:25:10 GMT -5
I try to be here pretty regularly and I just caught myself up on what happened.
I'm only here to say that I'll be watching/ lurking to see what changes come about before I decide whether I want to be posting here again. And I hope those who I've spoken openly with about my struggles (with 2IF, Borderline PD, etc) will maintain my confidentiality.
...FWIW I think it would asking a lot/silly/potentially alienating to put a warning every time someone talks about their kids or pregnancy here.
Very true. Sometimes a person may only make a slight mention of kids or pregnancy, but have the main focus of the post be about something completely different in their lives. Or if someone new comes onto the board they could be too nervous to talk if they are met by a page full of ****trigger warnings****.
I do think going forward it would be helpful for initial announcements, like BFPs, losses, and other potentially sensitive situations. However, if someone is actively participating in the weekly check-in and gets a BFP, there wouldn't be a need for them to include a trigger warning every week after the inital announcement because it becomes expected they might mention it in their check-in.
I completely agree - trigger warnings for initial BFP announcements or losses, but not for amy post involving kids or pregnancies. And I would add any type of abuse/DV situation which could easily come up on this board and could be very triggering for people.
I will be honest - I might forget about trigger warnings. I'm just not used to posting on boards that use these. And like others have pointed out, there may be a LOT of potential triggers on this board. I'm not sure I'm mentally together enough to remember to tiptoe around everyone's triggers...
I will be honest - I might forget about trigger warnings. I'm just not used to posting on boards that use these. And like others have pointed out, there may be a LOT of potential triggers on this board. I'm not sure I'm mentally together enough to remember to tiptoe around everyone's triggers...
This...I'll try my best to use them but often when stressed, looking for support that "remember trigger warning" might be forgotten. Plus I'm having a little trouble with using a warning the first time you mention BFP, etc but not needing it later. That requires the reader to remember each poster and their posts. No? I'm a little confused. Last thing I want to do is trigger anyone accidentally.
I will be honest - I might forget about trigger warnings. I'm just not used to posting on boards that use these. And like others have pointed out, there may be a LOT of potential triggers on this board. I'm not sure I'm mentally together enough to remember to tiptoe around everyone's triggers...
This...I'll try my best to use them but often when stressed, looking for support that "remember trigger warning" might be forgotten. Plus I'm having a little trouble with using a warning the first time you mention BFP, etc but not needing it later. That requires the reader to remember each poster and their posts. No? I'm a little confused. Last thing I want to do is trigger anyone accidentally.
Well, the idea would be that anyone who is regularly participating in check-ins would just kind of give a heads up with a major announcement. For anyone new, I would encourage them to lurk first before posting so that they can better understand the tone of the board.
Can we revisit the topic of what to do about breaches of privacy? I read through the GKU post and I do not think that breach was malicious. Obviously I don't know the history between all of you that post there, so I could be wrong. But it seems like we have just decided to kick someone out based on one mistake. If that is how this board is going to work I am afraid I won't be able to go here. I come here for compassion and understanding, and I would hope for some forgiveness if I screw up on something like trigger warnings (I don't think I post anywhere else with any of you so I probably wouldn't be making the same mistake that just happened). I appreciate this discussion but I think we are skirting around an issue that needs to be addressed - one of regs and leaders who is directly related to this discussion is not here to participate. I don't think that's right. I am tired and stressed so I could be totally reading things wrong. Please feel free to set me straight. I have really gained a lot from this board and I don't know where else I would get the kind of support I've received here, so I'd like to see it live on in a way I'm comfortable with. Like I said, whether you all think the board should be totally password protected or whatever, a mod holds the password and member roster, whatever, I'll probably be fine with that. The issue I have is what happens if someone doesn't follow the privacy rules we decide on. I need to go to bed. Sorry if this doesn't make sense. And @led and @sluttybigb00bz, I am sorry about the breach. I can understand why you would be upset about it, and I don't want it to happen again, to anyone.
Can we revisit the topic of what to do about breaches of privacy? I read through the GKU post and I do not think that breach was malicious. Obviously I don't know the history between all of you that post there, so I could be wrong. But it seems like we have just decided to kick someone out based on one mistake. If that is how this board is going to work I am afraid I won't be able to go here. I come here for compassion and understanding, and I would hope for some forgiveness if I screw up on something like trigger warnings (I don't think I post anywhere else with any of you so I probably wouldn't be making the same mistake that just happened). I appreciate this discussion but I think we are skirting around an issue that needs to be addressed - one of regs and leaders who is directly related to this discussion is not here to participate. I don't think that's right. I am tired and stressed so I could be totally reading things wrong. Please feel free to set me straight. I have really gained a lot from this board and I don't know where else I would get the kind of support I've received here, so I'd like to see it live on in a way I'm comfortable with. Like I said, whether you all think the board should be totally password protected or whatever, a mod holds the password and member roster, whatever, I'll probably be fine with that. The issue I have is what happens if someone doesn't follow the privacy rules we decide on. I need to go to bed. Sorry if this doesn't make sense. And @led and @sluttybigb00bz, I am sorry about the breach. I can understand why you would be upset about it, and I don't want it to happen again, to anyone.
I bolded a few of the lines to address them:
1. I believe the consensus of this board membership is that they were not malicious. However, I support that @led and @sluttybigb00bz can assert how the post affected them with or without intent to harm.
2. This discussion is a result of that post, but we intentionally have been skirting around the issue to keep the discussion about the future of the board. The User in the other thread is welcome to come and post here, but I know some of her IRL friends, who love her and want the best for her advised her to take a break for her own wellness.
At this point we are not using the confidential board, and any check-ins/posts are happening on the public forum.
We have not yet decided on any moderation for this board, so it is not for any of us to say who can and cannot post here. If this user chose to rejoin this community I do believe she would find a supportive, forgiving group.
I wanted to post in a different post because this is unrelated mostly to my response to the earlier post.
If you are finding a user triggering, our forum does have a function to "hide posts from user"
I also move that we should have a Newbie post for this group.
As for trigger warnings, we could have a common list of trigger warnings. Things like loss of a pregnancy, death of a loved one (particularly when related to a mental illness), or pet would feel fairly obvious. BFPs are joyous announcements unless you have been through IF and then they are painful reminders. They can also be terrifying times for those who have been through loss. So these four would be my suggestions of trigger warnings.
Also using your best judgement: If you are posting about something that really upset you, then the chances are it could really upset someone else. (example: recent news article involving the Duggars)
Do I think we should shun or ban someone who forgets a trigger warning. Definitely not. Chances are that if you are so upset you forget a trigger warning, it will be a time you need the board the most. This is where a mod could come in and add a warning. This wouldn't be a call out, just a helpful favour.
Can we revisit the topic of what to do about breaches of privacy? I read through the GKU post and I do not think that breach was malicious. Obviously I don't know the history between all of you that post there, so I could be wrong. But it seems like we have just decided to kick someone out based on one mistake. If that is how this board is going to work I am afraid I won't be able to go here. I come here for compassion and understanding, and I would hope for some forgiveness if I screw up on something like trigger warnings (I don't think I post anywhere else with any of you so I probably wouldn't be making the same mistake that just happened). I appreciate this discussion but I think we are skirting around an issue that needs to be addressed - one of regs and leaders who is directly related to this discussion is not here to participate. I don't think that's right. I am tired and stressed so I could be totally reading things wrong. Please feel free to set me straight. I have really gained a lot from this board and I don't know where else I would get the kind of support I've received here, so I'd like to see it live on in a way I'm comfortable with. Like I said, whether you all think the board should be totally password protected or whatever, a mod holds the password and member roster, whatever, I'll probably be fine with that. The issue I have is what happens if someone doesn't follow the privacy rules we decide on. I need to go to bed. Sorry if this doesn't make sense. And @led and @sluttybigb00bz, I am sorry about the breach. I can understand why you would be upset about it, and I don't want it to happen again, to anyone.
I bolded a few of the lines to address them:
1. I believe the consensus of this board membership is that they were not malicious. However, I support that @led and @sluttybigb00bz can assert how the post affected them with or without intent to harm.
2. This discussion is a result of that post, but we intentionally have been skirting around the issue to keep the discussion about the future of the board. The User in the other thread is welcome to come and post here, but I know some of her IRL friends, who love her and want the best for her advised her to take a break for her own wellness.
At this point we are not using the confidential board, and any check-ins/posts are happening on the public forum.
We have not yet decided on any moderation for this board, so it is not for any of us to say who can and cannot post here. If this user chose to rejoin this community I do believe she would find a supportive, forgiving group.
Post by bluerainfire on Jun 8, 2015 6:35:59 GMT -5
ok- I admit I skimmed these pages-there was a lot of reading
first of all- I want a link of what was posted, and where- so I can decided if it was out of order- and a clear explanation of who or what was involved. If it was an active member of the board, I want her side of the story too-
I don't know if something was shared, was there copied and pasted words? or was she telling her struggle?
on objective note- the person might be self sabotaging herself- if it's a person who has mental health issues and at a serious low point- she might be creating chaos, so she can self justify self hatred. I think this needs to be addressed to- it's important too-
secondly when I post here- I am fully aware that this is the internet- things can be copied and pasted- in a perfect world, I could make believe thing are truly private. But they are not, not even on a confidential board- so I still tone it down-
I would love a disclosed commuinty, and a safe place- but, this again is the internet-
though I thought the confidential board was more about being more private- less open, so not every viewer can see it- but even then, I didn't share every detail of my life-
let's also address there's just a stigma about mental health in general- no one want's to be attacked, have there words used against them-
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