Bullying, what's your take on it?

[peanuts]

So my sister told me this morning her 5 year old has been crying before school every day because he's being picked on at lunch and doesn't want to go. I just can't believe bullying at 5 years old is real! But anyway, it got me thinking about the different approaches parents have in regards to bullying, so I thought it could start a good discussion.

I told my sister to let him stick up for himself. There are two lessons that need to be learned.
1, that he is allowed to stick up for himself. That shouldn't be such a big deal these days! So what if he gets sent home, at least he defended himself.

2, these bullies need to learn there are consequences for picking on someone, especially when that person stands up to them.

To me, by standing by and not "tattling" as my sister said, it just teaches him that it's OK for kids to bully him.

She made a big deal saying she doesn't want him to be a "tattle tale" or to "get in trouble". IMO, so what. I'd rather my children get sent home for sticking up for themselves and/or someone else rather than be the bully themselves.

ETA stick up for themselves within reason, of course. Not saying they should go punch someone the first time they say something bad about them.   

[Deleted]

I think our society has become overly sensitive and everything now is lumped into the bullying category. While I agree , it sucks that there are mean kids out there, learning to stand up and defend for yourself builds character. Mean kids grow up into mean adults. Kids will be kids, and yes there are extreme cases that most certainly qualify as bullying and should be addressed but a lot of the time it's just kids being stupid and learning as they go along. I don't consider myself traumatized bc someone wasn't super duper nice to me. I completely agree with 101% with the OP. I'd rather my kid get punished for standing up for himself then be upset and afraid to go to school.

[vk]

I don't know if I am phrasing this correctly...

I think bullying needs to be (can only be?) stopped by the parents of the bully. If my parents don't have a problem with it then I won't stop. I know parents will say "oh it is harmless, they are just kids" etc but if your kid is an asshole you need to fix it not just brush it off.

I think that a child needs to learn to stand up for themselves, which is easier said than done.

[vk]

Jan 30, 2015 11:32:31 GMT -5 sweeetp812 said:

I think our society has become overly sensitive and everything now is lumped into the bullying category. While I agree , it sucks that there are mean kids out there, learning to stand up and defend for yourself builds character. Mean kids grow up into mean adults. Kids will be kids, and yes there are extreme cases that most certainly qualify as bullying and should be addressed but a lot of the time it's just kids being stupid and learning as they go along. I don't consider myself traumatized bc someone wasn't super duper nice to me. I completely agree with 101% with the OP. I'd rather my kid get punished for standing up for himself then be upset and afraid to go to school.

I agree with this. People tend to throw out the word BULLY too quickly. Getting your feelings hurt because someone doesn't want to be your friend is one thing and I don't consider to be bullying, but repetitive abuse (like OP) I think is.

[peanuts]

Jan 30, 2015 11:44:39 GMT -5 vk said:

Jan 30, 2015 11:32:31 GMT -5 sweeetp812 said:

I think our society has become overly sensitive and everything now is lumped into the bullying category. While I agree , it sucks that there are mean kids out there, learning to stand up and defend for yourself builds character. Mean kids grow up into mean adults. Kids will be kids, and yes there are extreme cases that most certainly qualify as bullying and should be addressed but a lot of the time it's just kids being stupid and learning as they go along. I don't consider myself traumatized bc someone wasn't super duper nice to me. I completely agree with 101% with the OP. I'd rather my kid get punished for standing up for himself then be upset and afraid to go to school.

I agree with this. People tend to throw out the word BULLY too quickly. Getting your feelings hurt because someone doesn't want to be your friend is one thing and I don't consider to be bullying, but repetitive abuse (like OP) I think is.

I totally agree. I was hesitant to use bullying for my title because I feel there is a much too fine a line between bullying and getting your feelings hurt. If your child is upset about their feelings hurt, that's a whole new lesson to teach. But true bullying, especially at 5 years old, needs to be addressed.

[Deleted]

And to add, there is now a movie coming out called the Duff, which apparently stands for designated ugly fat friend. While i have no idea what the premise of the movie is, in today's society, if my kid or myself called someone fat it would be considered bullying and would need to be addressed with sensitivity training

[puffandstuff]

I was picked on by one particular girl and we later became friends. My parents helped me work through the situation. I was very shy and needed coaching. I am grateful that they taught me how to handle the situation rather than protect me from it.

My cousin claimed she was being picked on, so her parents started homeschooling her. She had the same issue in college, so she started taking online classes instead of going to class. Now she's unemployed and still lives with her parents because every job she ever had people picked on her and she couldn't handle it. She quit every job she had for the same reason.

[minervamae]

I've witnessed 2 year olds purposely torture each other when they know what buttons will make each other scream in misery.

This is generally one giant gray area. It depends on the kids involved on how I would handle it. My oldest (4) is a drama llama...I'll hear for a week about how some one looked at her funny. So we spend a lot of time talking about how she can manage herself. My DD2 is an easy going get along kind of kid who rarely complains, so if she was dodging going and upset about things, I'd take her more seriously and ask for details. Then we'd talk about how safe she felt, what options she has, etc. and I'd talk to the school for them to keep an eye on things. Some things can be managed between kids and some can't.

[peanuts]

Jan 30, 2015 11:53:08 GMT -5 puffandstuff said:

I was picked on by one particular girl and we later became friends. My parents helped me work through the situation. I was very shy and needed coaching. I am grateful that they taught me how to handle the situation rather than protect me from it.

My cousin claimed she was being picked on, so her parents started homeschooling her. She had the same issue in college, so she started taking online classes instead of going to class. Now she's unemployed and still lives with her parents because every job she ever had people picked on her and she couldn't handle it. She quit every job she had for the same reason.

Yikes. Just yikes.

[Deleted]

I would want my child to stick up for herself (within reason) but I would also want to talk to a teacher and get a neutral opinion on the situation. I don't think a 5 year old can give an unbiased version of events.

[mrsnorris]

Jan 30, 2015 11:32:31 GMT -5 sweeetp812 said:

I think our society has become overly sensitive and everything now is lumped into the bullying category. While I agree , it sucks that there are mean kids out there, learning to stand up and defend for yourself builds character. Mean kids grow up into mean adults. Kids will be kids, and yes there are extreme cases that most certainly qualify as bullying and should be addressed but a lot of the time it's just kids being stupid and learning as they go along. I don't consider myself traumatized bc someone wasn't super duper nice to me. I completely agree with 101% with the OP. I'd rather my kid get punished for standing up for himself then be upset and afraid to go to school.

So much this.  Bullying exists and is a very real problem and I'm glad it's getting more attention.  However, it drives me insane that EVERYTHING is now "bullying".  As a K-1 teacher, parents were constantly telling me that their child was getting bullied by so-and-so.  Obviously I was glad to know when there was an issue between students that I might not have been aware of (though I almost always was and usually knew more about it than the parents) and I took those things seriously but well over half the time the parent had a very skewed view of what was happening and there was nothing like bullying going on whatsoever.  Most often, it was just kids who had an argument or were young and lacked conflict management skills.  I also didn't like the idea that every time a child has someone say something unkind to them they should immediately have an adult intervene.  Obviously, it's good for adults to be aware and keep an eye on a situation but as much as possible I want my child (and wanted my students) to work things out.  They need to learn those skills.  And the solutions tend to last longer when they come from the kids.

[redhorizon343]

Yes, kids need to be taught to work out their problems. But these kids aren't in middle school, they're 5. They're still learning what social norms are, how to communicate effectively, and they're still learning to be sensitive to the feelings of others.

I think the best course of action for the mother would be to make the teacher aware of the situation, ask that whoever is in the cafeteria be made aware of the problem as well. Just to monitor the situation, be on the look out, and mediate between the two kids when issues arise. To help them better learn to communicate. I think the teacher would appreciate being made aware that there is some anxiety about it so that s/he could just keep a closer eye on the interactions between the two. It is a common problem, and if s/he is aware of poor behavior at school, she can go to the parents of that child and discuss the specifics with them as a witness to the events.

It's harder and harder for the teacher to control social interactions between students as students get older, but at this age s/he should be a helpful team member.

[redhorizon343]

mrsnorris we are so on the same page.

[Deleted]

Sometimes though kids will go home and tell their parent what happened, and the helicopter parents that are out there can
Make the situation worse. While 5 year olds can't really resolve their conflict, sometimes parents do make the situation worse if they believe their precious child would either never say anything mean and can do no wrong or if their feel their precious cargo was offended in the worst possible way. Those are the kind of situations that I dread happening. Because an exchange between two kids can be misconstrued by overly sensitive adults

[blckroses]

This whole thread has made me realize that I'm not even close to prepared to deal with these types of issues.

I agree that the word bullying has gotten out of hand. I also think kids should be given the opportunity to handle issues like that on their own first before adults step in. At age 5, though, I think an adult at the school needs to be aware of the situation, in case it escalates.

I was bullied in middle school, as in every day was teased and taunted by a group of 'mean girls' who ganged up on my one friend and me. Adults at the school did nothing. I got in a couple of physical fights with these girls, but we all got through it and survived. I know there are cases where bullying gets out of hand and someone needs to step in, but we also need to teach our kids how to handle these situations themselves.

[weeklyplanner]

Jan 30, 2015 12:18:39 GMT -5 @bazi45 said:

I would want my child to stick up for herself (within reason) but I would also want to talk to a teacher and get a neutral opinion on the situation. I don't think a 5 year old can give an unbiased version of events.

This! As a former K teacher, I would tell my kid to tell the teacher. Five year olds are really still babies. It's a learning opportunity for everyone.

I also think the term bully gets overused.

If my child was older, maybe starting around 3rd grade, I'd tell him to stick up for himself. I would not condone violence and he would be in big trouble if he started the violence. But, I'd probably tell him to hit back. As an adult, so much can be said by just walking away, but kids would turn it into another kid running away/scared.

[mrsnorris]

Jan 30, 2015 14:34:38 GMT -5 sweeetp812 said:

Sometimes though kids will go home and tell their parent what happened, and the helicopter parents that are out there can
Make the situation worse. While 5 year olds can't really resolve their conflict, sometimes parents do make the situation worse if they believe their precious child would either never say anything mean and can do no wrong or if their feel their precious cargo was offended in the worst possible way. Those are the kind of situations that I dread happening. Because an exchange between two kids can be misconstrued by overly sensitive adults

For the most part I agree but as a former K teacher I'll say that the bolded isn't necessarily true. With a lot of teaching of strategies and with the support of adults available as a back-up most 5yos are capable of doing more of their own conflict resolution than we give them credit for. They need to be given the tools and strategies and have a supportive environment in which to practice and apply those skills. We worked very hard to build those skills along with creating a school climate and culture that supported these skills. Lots of parents were surprised at how well their children did at this and would comment on how they used these tools at home, too. Unfortunately sometimes parents tried to "help" and instead cut off their child's ability to solve problems. Obviously there are circumstances that require immediate adult intervention (such as TRUE bullying) but for garden variety playground disagreements I believe in being a support to kids in solving their own problems whenever possible even though it's often more work for the adults.

[Chrisse]

I agree with many of the PPs.

I feel like "bullying" is such a buzzword these days. Please, God, let kids stick up for themselves and work through things. Conflict resolution or schoolyard justice. Yes, adult intervention is required for the more extreme situations, but these are skills required as an adult. I'm sure we all either were teased (or did the teasing) or witnessed it growing up, and learned something from it.

[jamjoyful]

While I agree that kids need to defend themselves we are talking about 5 year olds. At this age, I think it makes sense to have the teacher be involved. I don't see 5 year olds working out any issues successfully on their own. Adult guidance seems necessary.