This is Where I Leave You - Discussion

[erpiccy]

I actually just watched this movie on Friday. I didn't read the book though. So many love triangles happening...

[ashiscute]

Sorry I'm slow. I read this book awhile back now so I may be forgetting something and haven't seen the movie. We may rent it tonight though.

1. Most dysfunctional- It's a toss up between Annie and Paul. I feel like they tried the hardest to seem normal but the amount of anger Paul had for Judd was almost unbelievable to me. I can't fathom holding onto anger at someone for that many years. But Annie's desperation for Paul seemed so misplaced. Like she was already married and regardless of the state of it this is it.

I agree the mother was the funniest and Paul was he worst. In some ways I felt like Wendy was the most sympathetic because there was so little "fairy tale" about her life. She didn't sugar coat things and didn't expect change and that made me feel like she should have it more.

I don't remember feeling like I identified with any of the characters.

Going into question #2 I wanted to see more with Jen.

2. I felt like the impression of Jen was so bitter and that was kind of disappointing. I understand that Judd was angry and hurt by her actions but in any relationship there are two sides and we didn't get to appreciate that. I wish she'd been in the book a little more and had a chance to make her case. I sort of feel like they had a chance to get together again but not sure how any of their pre-cheating issues would be addressed. I would like to read a follow up on their relationship.

3. I feel like Hillary was sort of the anti-mom but not a bad one. She was unexpected and treated her children like adults when most moms did not. I think she would have been embarrassing to have as a parent but she was a great character. I think the irony of being a parenting guru is that it makes the kids feel they will be judged for being less than perfect which is a hard feeling as an older child/teenager. I think Hillary did not give a shit how others viewed her family.

4. Phillip's problems are the most insurmountable. He only wants a relationship in the most vague sense of the terms. He wants to be taken care of but he is not capable of taking care of someone else. I don't think he's able to or really interested in any sacrifices that make a relationship possible.

Paul and Annie's relationship (told by Judd) seemed to lack basic intimacy. Everything seemed like a sense of duty for them. I feel like they could stay together but there would be so much bitterness for them.

Wendy and Barry have a relationship of convenience and something you question if there was any real affection at all. But I really think there was they just chose each other for the wrong reasons. Their relationship was the hardest to watch but maybe that's because it wasn't over the top or forced.

5. The end of the book seemed more fantasy than real life. I wish we had seen a bit more of Judd's real life with or without Jen. Before he shiva they made him a bit too pathetic and after left him sort of in limbo. I think his relationship with his family was handled so well but I didn't really see where he went in real life.

I'll add if I catch the movie. I apologize for the undoubted multiple errors. I wrote this on mobile.

[cookiesandwine]

Ok I read this book a couple months before it was nominated for book club so don't judge if my memories are fuzzy!!

1. What's wrong with these people! Whom do you finger as the most dysfunctional family member, including spouses? Which character do you find...funniest...most despicable...most sympathetic? Be honest, now: any of them you identify with? Were there any characters you would have liked to see developed further?

Disfunctional-The sister-in-law that pretty much raped him. I'm adding a hated the most-his ex-boss, just gave me the creeps. Funniest-The youngest brother (Phillip?) I found myself sympathizing more with the sister with small kids (Wendy) because she was the only one with kids. I would have liked to see more about the mom and dad's relationship and them as people independently of their children's perceptions, but that would have been hard to do.


2. What was your first impression of Judd’s wife, Jen? Because you see her almost entirely from Judd’s perspective, was there any chance to see her as a sympathetic character before Judd finds her so? Do you think that Judd and Jen have a chance at salvaging their relationship, with or without a baby girl to raise?

First impression, obviously not great. It was interesting how as a reader I ended up rooting for them to reconcile as he started being more sympathetic to her.

3. Discuss Judd’s mother and her relationship with each of her children. Do you think that Hillary Foxman was truly a bad mother? Was there any real irony in her being a child-rearing guru? What was your opinion of her character?

There was all of the irony in her being a child rearing guru! I think she had too many theories and experiments on her own kids, but not enough practice just being their mom.

4. Also, compare and contrast the various romantic relationships in this book: who, do you think, had the most admirable or lasting relationship? Who had the most realistic one? Who had the most insurmountable problems? (Is there such a thing as an insurmountable problem, especially looking at problems from Phillip’s point of view?)

I don't remember their stories well enough...

5. What did you think of Judd’s exit at the end of the shiva? Was his disappearance in Phillip’s Porsche realistic? Appropriate? Did you find it a satisfying resolution to the book?

Not realistic but appropriate. I wanted to know what happened to all the characters after the book ended, but I feel like after every book I read!

[kellwhy]

I'm slow. I started writing out my responses on my laptop, but I got distracted by other stuff. I'll finish it tomorrow and comment on the rest of your posts then.

[Deleted]

Jan 19, 2015 8:20:33 GMT -5 @justinslovo said:

Edited because I didn't mean to quote.

I also read this forever ago, but watched the movie recently, so please forgive me if my memories are colored more by the movie than the book.  If anyone enjoyed this book and wanted to read more by Jonathan Tropper, I recently finished his "How to Talk to a Widower" and thought that was good (though as might be obvious, dark).

1. What's wrong with these people! Whom do you finger as the most dysfunctional family member, including spouses? Which character do you find...funniest...most despicable...most sympathetic? Be honest, now: any of them you identify with? Were there any characters you would have liked to see developed further?   Annie, by far.  I think the infertility issue has driven her completely nuts, and mixed with some unresolved ex issues, I think she is the messiest.  I think Phillip brings some levity, though he's also horribly dysfunctional, and if he were my younger sibling, would drive me nuts (I think Adam Driver played him perfectly in the movie).  I find Wendy the most sympathetic, though she did marry Barry, so I do have some element of "you made your own bed" with her character too.

2. What was your first impression of Judd’s wife, Jen? Because you see her almost entirely from Judd’s perspective, was there any chance to see her as a sympathetic character before Judd finds her so? Do you think that Judd and Jen have a chance at salvaging their relationship, with or without a baby girl to raise?   HATE her.  I'm pretty hard line on cheating though, especially if it was an on-going thing, and especially because it was Judd's boss.  It was a really awful thing to do on so many levels, and I don't see how you come back from that.  I'm sure from her perspective, Judd was distant, she was lonely and lost and maybe wanted to hurt him, but in my world, the answer to those problems is not to cheat on your husband.  I can see at parts how it seems like they might have a chance at reconciling, I just don't think any reconciliation would ultimately work because I can't imagine them resolving all the unresolved/unspoken issues.

3. Discuss Judd’s mother and her relationship with each of her children. Do you think that Hillary Foxman was truly a bad mother? Was there any real irony in her being a child-rearing guru? What was your opinion of her character?  So much irony.  She's funny from a distance, but I think she's ultimately a pretty shitty mother.  She's manipulative and I don't get much support from her.  Her kids are all goddamn messes who can't communicate.  If I were her, I would feel like I failed.  

4. Also, compare and contrast the various romantic relationships in this book: who, do you think, had the most admirable or lasting relationship? Who had the most realistic one? Who had the most insurmountable problems? (Is there such a thing as an insurmountable problem, especially looking at problems from Phillip’s point of view?)  I think Wendy and Barry's was probably the most realistic one.  There are quite a few couples in my circle where the cracks are starting to show, and no one is communicating, and I think you add kids to that mix and you end up with Wendy and Barry.  I don't think anyone had a particularly admirable or lasting relationship, except maybe the mother at the end - that relationship, unlike all the others, seemed built on communication and deep feeling.

5. What did you think of Judd’s exit at the end of the shiva? Was his disappearance in Phillip’s Porsche realistic? Appropriate? Did you find it a satisfying resolution to the book?
 I think it was an appropriate end to the book, and I can see some scenarios in real-life where a character behaves that way.  


Bonus Question: Did you watch the movie? What parts were you upset were left out of the movie?  I did watch the movie, and I was pleasantly surprised as critics seemed to be very luke-warm on it, but I thought it was very well done (and cast).  I can't remember what was left out though, as it had been so long since I read and I forgot to re-read before we did this thing.  

[cookiesandwine]

I'm such a terrible *analyzer* of books, but I really enjoyed reading everyone else's thoughts and found myself nodding in agreement and thinking, "Oh yeah, that too!"

[meimei]

I've really enjoyed reading everyone's responses. I haven't actually finished the book because... It was a drag. I really disliked almost all the characters and so had little sympathy for them. The book to the point I read to represents a very jaded perspective of realism, and it's just sad to me. I want a little more sunshine in my books, I guess.

I will say, I loved the dry, sarcastic writing style. Some of the descriptions and random anecdotes actually made me laugh aloud, while I was simultaneously cringing and wanting to look away. That's a skill.