Intro: EPer Hoping to Nurse

[birch113]

Hi everyone,

I'm new around the BF board. My LO, almost 9 weeks, has had a lot of hurdles preventing him from successfully BFing. He had a tongue and lip ties, which we had clipped. Our first LC basically told me my supply sucked and to pump what I could if I wanted and bottle feed. I've been almost totally EPing since NYE, but have tried periodically to nurse.

LC #2 said his Torticollis was the issue, preventing him from opening his mouth wide enough to latch. He's been in therapy for this and has made fantastic progress. Now that he's opening his mouth wide enough to latch, we find he's a tongue thruster.

My new LC suggested football hold so that gravity is on my boob's side so he can't thrust it out.

Being able to nurse my baby has been something I've wanted so badly, which is why I won't give up. I've worked really hard to get my supply up, and generally pump ~ 25oz/day. I'm really worried about maintaining my supply. I just rented a Medela scale to do weighted feeds at home (thanks for the suggestion a while back, @amyg!) and im hoping we find our rhythm.

Does anyone else have a tongue thruster? Were you able to make BFing work?

[melody330]

Welcome!

I don't have a tongue thruster, but I just wanted to say good luck

[birch113]

Thanks, melody330! I hope I'll be here to stay!

[nursefrizz]

I don't know if DD was a tongue thruster, per se, but she would put her tongue up on the roof of her mouth when she opened up, so my nipple would hardly get in her mouth. Football hold was what worked for us in the beginning. I'd also kind of hold her chin down once she opened her mouth and shove the boob in really fast so her tongue wouldn't have a chance to get in the way (sounds a lot more forceful that it was haha). Sometimes it would still happen and we'd unlatch and try it again. She eventually got the hang of it.

I'm sorry you've not had the best luck with LCs. I'm with you there. It's extremely frustrating.

Good luck! Let us know how it goes!

[nursefrizz]

Also, congrats on making it to 9 weeks of EPing. That is a huge feat in itself!

[birch113]

Thanks for the advice, nursefrizz! Thanks for the support, too! If nursing doesn't work out for us, I'm planning to EP as long as possible for my little guy, hoping to make it the year.

[ellabee]

Welcome! No experience with tongue thrusting here, but good luck. I hope you're able to make it work! I'm now essentially 50% pumping (at work) and 50% nursing, so just wanted to give you props for EPing - it's definitely not the highlight of my day.

[bonnesetter27]

I don't have tongue thrust experience but DD did have a PTT and LT. We didn't have it lasered until she was 12 weeks old. I EP'd prior to that. It took about a week for her to even consider latching and even then it was just for a few seconds and with a shield and SNS. It took awhile but now she is a breastfeeding champ. I don't know much about tongue thrusting but I do feel like we worry too much about small things. Just keep trying and working with the LC. Maybe a sns would help you too. It would get him back to breast and help to increase your supply. I really just wanted to tell you that there can be success after a tongue clip a little later on.

[Shoe Crazy Me]

I don't think my LO was a tongue thruster, but I didn't work with a LC so who knows.  I did EP for the first four months.  We gradually got back to breastfeeding starting out using a nipple shield.  We did wean off the nipple shield too.

i remember how terrifying it was to not be able to see how much milk I was producing.  I was so scared of a supply dip after I worked so very hard to increase my supply.  Weighed feedings will definitely help.  Also, theresat858 told me that no supply dip is permenant. That gave me great piece of mind.

You could also pump after feedings for awhile to help ensure you keep your supply up.  But I wonder if that could create an oversupply?  Which I know doesn't seem like a bad thing right now, but it can make it harder for baby to latch.

Good luck!  I was able to switch to 100% breastfeeding and if BFed my LO until 16 months.  But I can't say we did it without tears (from both of us).  Early on our Pedi said "breastfeeding is hard, but if you stick with it you'll get it!"


 

[birch113]

Feb 13, 2015 18:57:13 GMT -5 bonnesetter27 said:

I don't have tongue thrust experience but DD did have a PTT and LT. We didn't have it lasered until she was 12 weeks old. I EP'd prior to that. It took about a week for her to even consider latching and even then it was just for a few seconds and with a shield and SNS. It took awhile but now she is a breastfeeding champ. I don't know much about tongue thrusting but I do feel like we worry too much about small things. Just keep trying and working with the LC. Maybe a sns would help you too. It would get him back to breast and help to increase your supply. I really just wanted to tell you that there can be success after a tongue clip a little later on.

Hey! Glad to see you here! Is the SNS that thing from Medela? I tried supplementing at the boob initially with a regular syringe and tube, but that was when he struggled to latch, and trying to get that in his mouth made it impossible. I bet he could do it now, though, and it never occurred to me to reintroduce it. That's a fantastic idea! Thanks so much for sharing your story. I honestly was feeling like since the tongue clip didn't get us BFing immediately, it wasn't going to at all. Here's hoping we end with a success story like yours!

[birch113]

Feb 14, 2015 8:15:13 GMT -5 Shoe Crazy Me said:

I don't think my LO was a tongue thruster, but I didn't work with a LC so who knows.  I did EP for the first four months.  We gradually got back to breastfeeding starting out using a nipple shield.  We did wean off the nipple shield too.

i remember how terrifying it was to not be able to see how much milk I was producing.  I was so scared of a supply dip after I worked so very hard to increase my supply.  Weighed feedings will definitely help.  Also, theresat858 told me that no supply dip is permenant. That gave me great piece of mind.

You could also pump after feedings for awhile to help ensure you keep your supply up.  But I wonder if that could create an oversupply?  Which I know doesn't seem like a bad thing right now, but it can make it harder for baby to latch.

Good luck!  I was able to switch to 100% breastfeeding and if BFed my LO until 16 months.  But I can't say we did it without tears (from both of us).  Early on our Pedi said "breastfeeding is hard, but if you stick with it you'll get it!"


 

So good to hear another success story that happened later on. I see so much progress in Miles, and I really think we have a good chance of getting there if we keep working at it, so long as we keep it positive and by too stressful for him. It's so good to hear that no supply dip is permanent. That's a huge fear of mine, and even an off day of pumping can send me into a panic that my supply is ruined. I've been hearing so much about windows for supply, having to be at a certain place by a certain time to stabilize things, and I worry about any setbacks. I will continue to pump after each feeding initially, but between seeing my pump output and weighted feeds, I will hopefully be able to make adjustments as needed. Right now, i fm could stand to up my supply a bit, as I barely keep up with LO. But I don't want to go overboard, either. Thanks!

[bonnesetter27]

Feb 14, 2015 15:34:31 GMT -5 birch113 said:

Feb 13, 2015 18:57:13 GMT -5 bonnesetter27 said:

I don't have tongue thrust experience but DD did have a PTT and LT. We didn't have it lasered until she was 12 weeks old. I EP'd prior to that. It took about a week for her to even consider latching and even then it was just for a few seconds and with a shield and SNS. It took awhile but now she is a breastfeeding champ. I don't know much about tongue thrusting but I do feel like we worry too much about small things. Just keep trying and working with the LC. Maybe a sns would help you too. It would get him back to breast and help to increase your supply. I really just wanted to tell you that there can be success after a tongue clip a little later on.

Hey! Glad to see you here! Is the SNS that thing from Medela? I tried supplementing at the boob initially with a regular syringe and tube, but that was when he struggled to latch, and trying to get that in his mouth made it impossible. I bet he could do it now, though, and it never occurred to me to reintroduce it. That's a fantastic idea! Thanks so much for sharing your story. I honestly was feeling like since the tongue clip didn't get us BFing immediately, it wasn't going to at all. Here's hoping we end with a success story like yours!


There is one from Medela and one from Lact-aid. I used the medela one. It is difficult to use and milk gets everywhere but it helped get us bfing. My lc gave me a picture of a puzzle about bfing. It said that all these pieces had to come together to make bfing work. The first piece was location. I had to start by feeding DD a bottle with my boob out next to it, I actually put the bottle in my armpit. She got used to laying in that position to eat and being near my breasts became a positive experience. It took awhile and it was step by step but it works. Have patience.

[Deleted]

Feb 12, 2015 19:22:43 GMT -5 birch113 said:

Hi everyone,

I'm new around the BF board. My LO, almost 9 weeks, has had a lot of hurdles preventing him from successfully BFing. He had a tongue and lip ties, which we had clipped. Our first LC basically told me my supply sucked and to pump what I could if I wanted and bottle feed. I've been almost totally EPing since NYE, but have tried periodically to nurse.

LC #2 said his Torticollis was the issue, preventing him from opening his mouth wide enough to latch. He's been in therapy for this and has made fantastic progress. Now that he's opening his mouth wide enough to latch, we find he's a tongue thruster.

My new LC suggested football hold so that gravity is on my boob's side so he can't thrust it out.

Being able to nurse my baby has been something I've wanted so badly, which is why I won't give up. I've worked really hard to get my supply up, and generally pump ~ 25oz/day. I'm really worried about maintaining my supply. I just rented a Medela scale to do weighted feeds at home (thanks for the suggestion a while back, @amyg!) and im hoping we find our rhythm.

Does anyone else have a tongue thruster? Were you able to make BFing work?

Ok so with tongue thrusting does h do it with the bottle or only with the breast?
Make sure bottle nipple is slow flow slowest you can get him to use premie sizzle even. Make sure paced feedings lots of stops to switch sides. Make sure he opens up wide and takes the bottle into his mouth not just pushing the bottle in there. Amt you are Givng is good as is supply and it's likely he'll get more when nursing once you both figure it out.

Lots and lots of skin to skin contact. Let him see breasts as comfy place. A sns would be a good option if he'll latch on. When he to gi thrusts and pushes the Breast out get him to suck on your finger and work you figur sci further and further into his mouth pushing down on his tongue so he learns to hold the nipple downward. You may want to experiment with a longer bottle nipple if you've been using a shirt or shallow one.

To encourage latching try a syringe or eh topper of milk to give milk as reward as soon as he latches on. Sns may help as well. Try varying positions. Laid back, side lying and football hold allow you to see a bit more of what he's doing and perhaps a deeper latch.

Be patient try as many times as you can before giving up and giving a bottle and make him work for the bottle with good form as well. When nursing watch for fast flow that may be a reason he's moving his tongue out of nursing position.

[birch113]

Feb 16, 2015 0:38:49 GMT -5 @amyg said:

Feb 12, 2015 19:22:43 GMT -5 birch113 said:

Hi everyone,

I'm new around the BF board. My LO, almost 9 weeks, has had a lot of hurdles preventing him from successfully BFing. He had a tongue and lip ties, which we had clipped. Our first LC basically told me my supply sucked and to pump what I could if I wanted and bottle feed. I've been almost totally EPing since NYE, but have tried periodically to nurse.

LC #2 said his Torticollis was the issue, preventing him from opening his mouth wide enough to latch. He's been in therapy for this and has made fantastic progress. Now that he's opening his mouth wide enough to latch, we find he's a tongue thruster.

My new LC suggested football hold so that gravity is on my boob's side so he can't thrust it out.

Being able to nurse my baby has been something I've wanted so badly, which is why I won't give up. I've worked really hard to get my supply up, and generally pump ~ 25oz/day. I'm really worried about maintaining my supply. I just rented a Medela scale to do weighted feeds at home (thanks for the suggestion a while back, @amyg!) and im hoping we find our rhythm.

Does anyone else have a tongue thruster? Were you able to make BFing work?

Ok so with tongue thrusting does h do it with the bottle or only with the breast?
Make sure bottle nipple is slow flow slowest you can get him to use premie sizzle even. Make sure paced feedings lots of stops to switch sides. Make sure he opens up wide and takes the bottle into his mouth not just pushing the bottle in there. Amt you are Givng is good as is supply and it's likely he'll get more when nursing once you both figure it out.

Lots and lots of skin to skin contact. Let him see breasts as comfy place. A sns would be a good option if he'll latch on. When he to gi thrusts and pushes the Breast out get him to suck on your finger and work you figur sci further and further into his mouth pushing down on his tongue so he learns to hold the nipple downward. You may want to experiment with a longer bottle nipple if you've been using a shirt or shallow one.

To encourage latching try a syringe or eh topper of milk to give milk as reward as soon as he latches on. Sns may help as well. Try varying positions. Laid back, side lying and football hold allow you to see a bit more of what he's doing and perhaps a deeper latch.

Be patient try as many times as you can before giving up and giving a bottle and make him work for the bottle with good form as well. When nursing watch for fast flow that may be a reason he's moving his tongue out of nursing position.

He thrusts at the bottle, too. I've tried the Calma nipples, and he struggles so much with them. I usually end up g
going to a Tommee Tippee (our usual) because he's so frustrated he's screaming and gives up. I've been thinking of trying Dr. Brown's with a premie nipple. I'll look into nipple length as well. Thanks, as always, for your advice!

[Deleted]

Tongue thrusting is often caused by a tongue tie. then if the tie is fixed it may then just be a habit.
Tongue thrusting can also be due to fast flow of a bottle nipple,
lots of moms find the tommee Tippee bottle to flow too fast.
Does milk come out of the bottle when you hold the bottle upside down or barely squeeze on it?

[birch113]

@amyg Yup, milk comes out when the bottle is tipped.

[Deleted]

Feb 17, 2015 9:45:00 GMT -5 birch113 said:

@amyg Yup, milk comes out when the bottle is tipped.

you need way way slower flow bottle nipple. Some really don't like the calma. not sure what's the better slow flow brands since they change all the time but look for something with a little longer nipple than current one something between shape of it and the calma. Or if you think it's too long go shorter. With a rally long nipple if the flow is too fast to stop the flow of milk with heir tongue it pushed the nipple out of their mouth.

It may take trial and error. But if you can get the flow slower so he doesn't love his tongue to the tip of the nipple to slow the flow he should stop thrusting. Which should transfer to breastfeeding. Sometimes you can use better bottle feeding to improve breastfeeding.