I want to talk to MH this weekend about the possibility of me SAH for a few years and then finding something part time. I'm so overwhelmed all the time, I don't get to spend enough time with C (and when I do I'm often stressed and trying to multi task which makes me feel guilty). I feel behind in everything and like I have no time to do things that would bring me joy. Every minute I'm not at work I'm busy and work is stressful too. Even with my flexible schedule - and often, because of it. I have to work so much harder to prove myself, and my PTO works differently, now, too. I can only take it in full day increments (which for me is 10 hours since I work 4 10s) or I wind up getting flagged and on a report for all the partners to see, so things like doctors appointments are a major source of stress. And money - with what we are paying the nanny, we are broke now, all the time. I'd rather be broke and home with C.
Thoughts on broaching the topic with MH? He will panic. I make more money (20% more) so he will freak out. I was thinking of asking him to set us up a meeting with the financial advisor he works with (wouldn't cost us anything) to see how we'd make it work...
Post by thatgirlrachel on Nov 11, 2016 8:16:10 GMT -5
cnf2013, I can't believe the house is done already! How exciting for you guys!!
geners, I think offering/asking to a financial advisor is a good idea. Before going to your H, maybe whip up a spreadsheet that shows all of your current expenses compared to his income, showing what your budget would look like if you made this change. You could show him that you've already crunched some numbers, plus list all of the other reasons you mentioned above. If nothing else, that will let your H know you have really thought about this and done the math and this isn't just a decision you wanted to make on a whim.
thatgirlrachel, I like that idea, i just don't know if I have enough info to do it before involving him. We have separate checking accounts that most of our pay is deposited into and certain bills come out of, so I don't have the clearest picture of his side of things. I did a couple years ago when we were buying our house, but the numbers have changed since then. I need to know his current net take home pay and bills beyond what goes in & out of our joint account. We'd have to look at it together. He knows how stressed I've been, and that I'm good with money so I'm hoping he'd at least entertain the discussion.
cnf2013 wut. Didn't you guys just buy it yay! Happy day for you!
geners maybe you just need a different child care set up? What if you went back to not working from home- so that your time together could be more dedicated? How easy will it be for you to get a job when you want one again? I think it doesn't hurt to look into things, and if you really want to stay home you will find a way... but idk. Toddlerhood makes me crazy. I don't know what DH and I would do if we didn't get time away. Obviously so many moms love staying at home, but I think it is hard either way.
ETA thinking ahead too, a global, prolonged recession is expected. How secure is DH's job?
So happy to have today off. Margs is home with me, and it is nice for once not to be trying to work from home. We went to the playground this morning to enjoy the nice morning. She can climb up and go down the slide all by herself! When did she get so grown up? All the other parents were like what a cute baby... and then she tore up the place! And 11 months today to boot.
cnf2013 wut. Didn't you guys just buy it yay! Happy day for you!
geners maybe you just need a different child care set up? What if you went back to not working from home- so that your time together could be more dedicated? How easy will it be for you to get a job when you want one again? I think it doesn't hurt to look into things, and if you really want to stay home you will find a way... but idk. Toddlerhood makes me crazy. I don't know what DH and I would do if we didn't get time away. Obviously so many moms love staying at home, but I think it is hard either way.
ETA thinking ahead too, a global, prolonged recession is expected. How secure is DH's job?
My WFH day is the only thing keeping me sane! The hours the other three days are killing me. I only see C for about a half hour before we start bedtime, and it's mainly spent eating dinner (an instant meal, I don't get to cook anymore which I used to enjoy), getting milk stored away and pump parts soaking, and getting changed. Then once he's asleep I'm running around like crazy getting stuff done, getting ready for the next day before finally getting in bed, late. And that's with MH doing more than his fair share. And he and I are just two ships passing those days. Thursdays I concentrate on work at home bc the nanny is there; it's also my day to do laundry.
I never cook, don't feel like I'm keeping the house clean to my standards, and don't see family and friends as much as I'd like. Our weekends are a whirlwind of errands, chores and occasional socializing - zero relaxing.. Idk, maybe I'd miss working. But to be honest my heart hasn't been in it at all since I went back after maternity leave. Not to mention I'm an introvert and I find being around people all day draining as is (though I do realize I'd still be home with a little person all day!).
I think it'd be easy enough to find something again someday. I'm a CPA and there's always work for us in public accounting or private industry. If I stayed in the same field anyway. MH's job should be safe - he's the #2 guy there and it's a growing field.
I have been feeling for a while now that my current schedule/situation isn't working. And then I got in trouble this week for using too much PTO (for my eye doctor appointments and Charlie doctor appointments mostly) over the last two months which was really embarrassing and also really frustrating to me (they feel with my flexible schedule I'm taking advantage of them by using my PTO, basically). And paying for the nanny is killing us. It works financially but just barely. The whole thing feels so precarious some days, I feel really ragged and stressed.
Sorry to take over the thread! Gah! I'm done now I swear, just been needing to get some of this out.
geners As an account I'm sure you're familiar with tax advantaged accounts, compounding interest, etc Do you have emergency fund? If not I'd save up 4-8 mos living expenses. Get a solid understanding of your family finances by plugging your info in to a program like Mint or Personal capital to see what you spend each month, where you can trim expenses, etc. Try living on only DH income and trimming expenses for a month or two to see if it's doable. If it works out then go for it.
I quit my job in June. I spent countless hours worrying about is it the right decision, what happens when I try to enter back into the workforce, etc etc. it came down to this: staying at home felt right for my family in this moment and I wasn't going to let fear dictate my decision. I'm a smart girl, I have an education, if I want to go back to work I'll make it happen.
geners I feel you on the multi-tasking stress and WFH guilt, and all of it.
what if you crunch the numbers on a few different scenarios so that you know whatever you're presenting to YH would work?
possibilities I could think of: would your firm consider letting you drop to PT? that might have impact on your benefits, so be sure to take that into consideration.
now that C is older is there a daycare that might cost less than an nanny? a couple days a week in daycare might be a good way for C to be social with other kids.
you're a CPA, right? would it be too complex to start your own business as a financial advisor or consultant?
I'm not sure if they'd let me go PT... it's rare in my industry and I already stick out like a sore thumb with my flexible schedule. My boss has expressed concern that if they give me too many concessions everyone will want them.
Definitely day care would be cheaper than a nanny so from a financial aspect that would help our current situation. But most of my stress isn't money related. It's not feeling excited about my job and hating leaving C every day, and almost feeling resentful towards my job while I'm there.
I started crunching numbers and I think it's possible, not easy but possible - and would only be for a few years. MH and I will have to look at it but if it doesn't work maybe I'll see about going PT and putting C in daycare. Idk. All I know is current situation hasn't been working.
I like the idea of trying living on just MH's salary for a while and seeing if it's doable. There are a lot of areas where we can cut costs. And I wouldn't do anything until March/April (after tax season) so have time to think about it, save extra etc.
Hmm gdaisy09 that's an idea... if nothing else I could potentially do tax returns and also there's some really niche stuff I do for my company that I could potentially get contracted to do on the side... hmm.
geners, I was thinking more about daycare if you find something else PT or once you get your own business off the ground.
Once we move I'm WFH full-time, but we are planning to put Iz in daycare 2-3 days a week so that I don't feel conflicted about giving her attention versus getting my work done. (2-3 days a week might run us $550-800/month). I'll feel better that she's with other kids her age getting play and social time in that she wouldn't get if she were home all day with me.
Post by evenkeeled on Nov 11, 2016 14:04:16 GMT -5
geners, what about looking for another job as well? You have a CPA which would translate well to almost any accounting department. I know that we have them at our mid management and higher positions and outside of end of year work normal hours with company set PTO, flex hours, etc. Maybe another industry would make a major difference.
Well, a good morning has left me grumpy. And now Margs just sliced open her thumb on a soda can it didn't hurt her all, but it is bleeding quite profusely. #moty
geners, what about looking for another job as well? You have a CPA which would translate well to almost any accounting department. I know that we have them at our mid management and higher positions and outside of end of year work normal hours with company set PTO, flex hours, etc. Maybe another industry would make a major difference.
Definitely a possibility. Trying to get what I want in a career out of my current job, feels a bit like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. They have been more flexible and supportive than I would have expected but it's still not quite working. I just want to see if there's any way I could stay home with C for a few years first, if possible.
geners , what about looking for another job as well? You have a CPA which would translate well to almost any accounting department. I know that we have them at our mid management and higher positions and outside of end of year work normal hours with company set PTO, flex hours, etc. Maybe another industry would make a major difference.
Definitely a possibility. Trying to get what I want in a career out of my current job, feels a bit like trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. They have been more flexible and supportive than I would have expected but it's still not quite working. I just want to see if there's any way I could stay home with C for a few years first, if possible.
So why not sell it to your husband as taking a sabbatical. Your current job leaves you unfulfilled and doesn't fit in any way. You will take a year off and reevaluate, look for something else or stay home. Maybe you will itch to go back, maybe not. Gives you a place to find something that fits for you but don't have to take something just because they offer.
evenkeeled I think that's a great point, a great way to look at it, and to present it to MH.
I know he will ultimately be supportive with whatever I want to do and make it work, if it will in fact work. I just want to think it through and handle it in such a way as to reduce his stress about it (he will worry). I know he knows how stressed I've been, I've mentioned to him many times I wish I could stay home with C etc - it won't be out of left field.
geners,I can totally relate to wanting to stay home. And if you can do it, that's great. I just want to mention when you are looking at your finances, please brutally honest with it. That was the hardest part for me. Is altering your lifestyle and spending habits to the extent necessary to stay home going to make it worth it? I don't say this as a way to suggest you couldn't do it, I just know it was something I had to look at hard. For instance, I like to buy M nice clothes and toys (which I know you like with C as well...that damn Tea Collection ) and if we didn't have my salary I would have to change my spending habits on clothes and toys for him. We also like to eat out, enjoy nice wines, and like to buy things for our house. All of these were going to have to be drastically cut if we wanted to make it on just my H's salary. We both decided at this time, we wouldn't be as happy making all of those changes. We have a set number for my H's salary in which we will be able to make the change from me working to SAH. It will probably be a while before we get there but at least we have an end goal.
Again, I don't say this in any way to insinuate that you couldn't do it but it seems like it would make a difference in your discretionary spending if you are currently making 20% more than your H. And obviously, I have no idea if that is even a concern for you, just from personal experience I hope you can work it out!
I dropped off my last donation of breast milk to the mom I have been donating to for the last 6 or so months. She got me a very nice card and a small gift. On one hand I am so glad to be done pumping and have room in my freezer again, but I am kind of sad I could only get her daughter to about 10 months. I would have liked to help them get to a year. But no way in hell was I continuing pumping for someone else alone! Later pump, don't let the door hit you on the way out
M is taking his 2nd plane ride this weekend. I really hope he is as good as he was on the first trip. I am SO excited to show him the ocean for the first time.
RoLoMa all good points, and definitely something we'd need to really think about. It would be a lot easier if our salaries were reversed! I would have to get so much better about budgeting, waiting for sales, meal planning etc. We've always kind of spent money willy-nilly because we could afford to and were still saving, I'd be interested to see where we could save if we really tried.
Thank you all for the honest input! This has been building up for a while and it's the first time I've really said it "out loud". Maybe it won't work that I can SAH full time, maybe it will, or maybe there are other changes I can make that'll help instead.. it feels good to talk it out & start exploring options, though!
So MH and I have been talking about it all night. He said he just wants me to be happy and he knows I've been wanting this, and let's crunch some numbers and see if we can make it work. After I got done nursing C and putting him down, MH had already put together a list of his monthly expenses that he could adjust or cut and some proposed changes to some of our joint expenses, like switching from an expensive cable package to Sling. We're still working through numbers but either way, we can implement some of these changes and save money starting right now, which is never a bad thing. If we figure out that it'll work for me to SAH, we'd start living on just his salary with the new budget starting in January after the holidays, and just bank my pay through the end of tax season to pad our savings. I don't want to get too excited yet but it does seem like it may be possible, and I'd have a lot of time to really think it through before acting on it at work.
Post by evenkeeled on Nov 12, 2016 11:19:18 GMT -5
Because I am a big advocate of women and women in the workplace (we are actually starting a women's initiative at my company and have partnered with Lean In on helping build it as well as trying to get Sharon Sanberg to speak at our conference, I wanted to just include this information more for everyone. This is not rain on anyone's parade but good information to have:
more than a third of mothers lean back from the workforce for an average of two years—much of what we hear about “stay-at-home” moms bears little resemblance to our lives. We don’t care overmuch about scones. And we take care of toddlers; we don’t resemble them. In fact, polls suggest most mothers want to return to full-time employment by the time their children are school-age. If we have failed, it is only in recognizing how, for mothers, discrimination and bias make this much easier said than done.
Even minor career breaks have dire economic consequences. Over a lifetime, women lose 18 percent of their earning power by leaving the workforce for only two years. A 2011 Harvard study revealed that female MBAs who took “a job interruption equivalent to 18 months” earned 41 percent less than male MBAs.
And these are the lucky ones: the ones who find work at all. A study published by the American Journal of Sociology found that people were significantly less willing to hire mothers over nonmothers. Moreover, “the recommended starting salary for mothers was $11,000 less than that offered to nonmothers.
Labor statistics show that while full-time working women without children earn 7 percent less than their male counterparts, women with children earn 23 percent less. A mother is also 50 percent less likely to be promoted than a woman without children. It’s no wonder there’s a saying among work-life experts: “If you want equality, die childless at 30.”
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It isn't fair and it will hopefully continue to change (though the recent election is not moving things in the right direction) but something to take into consideration. I would advice to anyone, taking off more than a year try to stay connected to your career field, even some side work, consulting, networking, schooling, etc. so that your resume continues to be "filled in".
I have seen with recruiting over the years how breaks in resumes impact candidates by hiring managers. This was very prevalent during the recession and how they explained the reasons why and the impressions the managers were left with. Breaks in resumes has a more negative impact on older candidates than younger ones. Depending on the company that the person was with, the break could be viewed as "partially their fault" by being assumed they were not a more desired employee. Women candidates who were out due to children had additional hurdles to show they have not lost their experience or energy to do the job. In fact, I had one hiring manager, an executive, questioned me about a very qualified female candidate that with her engagement ring did we think that she would be having children soon and wouldn't be a long term employee as a reason to question her hire-ability.
I did not realize how prevalent sexism still I became an executive. There is most definitely still a glass ceiling and the boy's club is still thriving.
I think that's all very true. My company is pretty good about stuff most of the time - three of the four partners in my office are women - but a lot of that still rings true. It's maybe a little different for me because I don't want to make partner ever, but I have worked hard in my career and I'm not totally sure I want to lose that. That said I have often thought that this isn't my forever career so who knows.
After sleeping on it we both woke up feeling a little unsure we are able to get comfortable with the decreased savings and safety net that would result. Now we are talking about me dropping down to part time and putting him in one of the nicer daycares I've had my eye on. I think that would make me feel a LOT better and the financial impact is way less. Optimistic!
MH already dealt with cable and cell phone stuff and we will be saving $200/month just on those things. Woohoo!
I guess that's one perk of teaching, we get paid on a very strict pays scale dictated by a union. The pay grid is right in our contract with hard numbers. No true ability to discriminate.
It's all true, though those studies don't have a great way to value the time spent at home with children, in raw numbers, mothers loose. I had my eyes opened to sexism in my work place a few years ago when my H got hired into an identical position to mine, he had 0 years experience and a high school diploma, I had 5 years experience, a BS, and was working on my MS. His starting salary was 16% higher than what I was making.
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