Doggy help

[britts22]

I know there are a lot of animal lovers on here and I could use your help. Our dog is 9 years old and probably a little spoiled. He's mostly well behaved except when it comes to food. tonight we were babysitting and he grabbed a cracker out of an 11 mo. old baby's hand. It really scared her (and she started bawling) but luckily he didn't hurt her. As we're TTC we're obviously worried about this for our child. Has anyone experienced this before? Obviously we can try some sort of training, but any other suggestions would be most welcome.

Tl; dr: dog grabs food (puffs) from babies, worried about him (unintentionally) hurting said babies.

[nicknack]

This can be really difficult, especially with a long history of reinforcement (9 years). Do you feed your dog any people food or scraps? If so, I would recommend to stop now and make sure that your dog only gets dog food and treats. You can work with him by holding people food in one hand (in fist so he can't take it) and telling him "leave it" and when he leaves it alone for increasing amounts of time give him a doggy treat. Start small- even just a few seconds- and work up to longer periods of time as he is successful. Something that also worked really well with my dog is giving a big yelp when he tries to snatch anything from your hand, as this startles them and teaches them it is not okay. Hope that helps!

[britts22]

Thank you nicknack, very helpful! We don't feed him many scraps but we'll stop altogether immediately. Great suggestions

[thechickencoop]

I agree with stopping all 'people food' treats immediately. I know, I know, you CAN teach an old dog new tricks, but, ah...I dunno, our 9 year old lab will *still* take food out of DS's hand if the opportunity presents itself. He's incredibly gentle about it, but it's hard when there's a cracker or whatever just hanging out there with no one paying attention.

[WVaRN]

No advice, just wanted to chime in and say your puppy is adorable.

[tromeo]

Along the lines of what the previous posters said, you want to train this from both angles, I think. Teaching your dog to "leave it" with people food is definitely the best suggestion, but I would simultaneously be teaching "Gentle" as well. Your dog should be gentle enough to take treats from an 11 month old. Further, when he does, he's going to associate all people (even tiny humans) as the bearer of food. It will make him respect them more (ie- he wouldn't have taken the puff from YOU without permission, would he?).

To teach it is a bit tricky, but make your dog sit and feed him a treat. If you feel teeth on your skin, make a correction noise and take the treat away. When he approaches you softly, say "Gentle" and give him the treat. If he's normally pretty rough with treats, you might have to mark the better behavior and not the correct behavior first, slowly working your way up to when he's super soft, gentle. I would encourage the taking of EVERY treat to be this way.

Lastly, I would correct the bad behavior when he does it by removing him from the room for a few minutes. Put him in the bathroom, or a bedroom and isolate him away from the family if he does something like that again. You want him to learn "If I take things from people, I don't get to be with people." After about 5 minutes (make sure he isn't whining or crying), let him loose but don't make a big deal about it. Just open the door and ignore him, going about what you were doing.

Hope this helps

[mainewifey]

My dog is so extremely stubborn and awful, but leave it and gentle (we use the word easy) were two of the easiest things for him to learn. I think mostly because they're easy to teach. I think you can teach old dogs new tricks, you just have to be very consistant, and continue to work on it and reinforce it even after they've gotten it down.

[brettanomyces]

Training is ongoing with my dog. He always has to sit if he's getting a treat and we've taught him to take it gently (his command is "nicely").

We have to be on top of him and notice when he is about to go for something and tell him to "leave it". It helps to distract him from whatever he's set his sights on (usually the cat) and we tell him to "go" to his designated area (under the couch). 

ETA: words

[Deleted]

The hard thing is your dog is 9 and probably used to the people food. Right now we are having a hard time with our dog because anything our kids drop on the floor, he runs and eats. Or if my kids walk away he runs and clears their plates. Something he has never done before! He is very spoiled as well! So we are trying to completely cut out people food, and when our boys are eating, we try to keep our dog in another room. It's hard, but training him to stay away from people food after giving him scraps for the last 6 years is really hard!

Honestly, just try to separate them when your 11 month old eats? I wish I had better advice. The rest of the ladies here had some pretty good advice as well!

[heatherj9603]

Does he know the leave it command? My dogs love trying to steal from kids because it's so easy! But when we have kids over, I have to enforce "leave it". If they ignore it, they get a time out in the kitchen.  Eventually the dog will realize that everytime they try to grab the food, they get a time out. So it's easy to nip it in the bud. 

Eta: don't use their crate for timeouts. Crates are their safe haven. We just out a baby gate up blocking them out of the kitchen or living room (depending on where we are) 

[pismoduo]

+1 on "timeout". Separating her from her people works exceptionally well for our JRT. The Shih Tzu, not so much. But I think that's more a laziness thing.

And ditto those who recommended teaching your dog to be gentle about taking things from people. Even if you can teach them not to take food without permission, it never hurts to make sure they know to do it gently when they have permission.

As for training - our dogs have always needed both positive and negative reinforcement. Negative reinforcement when they do something wrong (usually just a sharp "No!" and the occasional timeout); positive when they do something right. Mostly we just had to watch them like a hawk for a while and try to head them off before they could snatch something from one of us or off a table or the floor. My dogs will now sit and stare at me while I cook (I'm notorious for dropping stuff) but won't go for anything on the floor unless I say "go ahead".

[lilsneezy]

Time outs don't really work for dogs since they live in the moment. If you want to train your dog not to do something then you have to stop the behavior BEFORE it happens. Punishing the dog after the fact isn't going to teach it anything. When you put a dog in a "time out" I can guarantee they're not sitting there thinking about what they did wrong. A dog doesn't rationalize its behavior like a human would. I agree with PP about teaching your dog how to take food gently, but you also have to look for what triggers the dog to grab food and what kind of behavior the dog exhibits right before he's about to do it (and then correct THAT behavior). For example, I can tell my dog is about to grab something if he's staring intently at it. Hold a cracker near your dog (don't tease him with it, just hold it where he can see it) and when you catch him focusing on it, that's when you firmly tell him "NO." Correcting the behavior before it happens will teach your dog how you want him to behave. Punishing him after the fact will just make him fear you.

[tromeo]

Mar 2, 2015 18:50:01 GMT -5 lilsneezy said:

Time outs don't really work for dogs since they live in the moment. If you want to train your dog not to do something then you have to stop the behavior BEFORE it happens. Punishing the dog after the fact isn't going to teach it anything. When you put a dog in a "time out" I can guarantee they're not sitting there thinking about what they did wrong. A dog doesn't rationalize its behavior like a human would. I agree with PP about teaching your dog how to take food gently, but you also have to look for what triggers the dog to grab food and what kind of behavior the dog exhibits right before he's about to do it (and then correct THAT behavior). For example, I can tell my dog is about to grab something if he's staring intently at it. Hold a cracker near your dog (don't tease him with it, just hold it where he can see it) and when you catch him focusing on it, that's when you firmly tell him "NO." Correcting the behavior before it happens will teach your dog how you want him to behave. Punishing him after the fact will just make him fear you.

Yes and no.  You're contradicting yourself.  If dogs lived so in the moment that they don't remember consequences of their actions, then they wouldn't be able to pick up any learned behavior.  They wouldn't know to be excited when their person came home every day because they would get a treat.  They wouldn't learn to be afraid of someone who abuses them.  Dogs do have an understanding of consequences and negative reinforcement does work when applied appropriately.  "Time outs" are generally considered a very effective training aide in conjunction with positive reinforcement

The idea is that removing a dog from something they want (ie- to be with people) when they exhibit a behavior that is undesirable (ie- being too assertive with an 11 month old, or jumping up on a person) reinforces that it is a bad behavior.  They learn this just as they learn to practice good behaviors when they get rewarded with something.

[lilsneezy]

Mar 2, 2015 20:46:14 GMT -5 tromeo said:

Mar 2, 2015 18:50:01 GMT -5 lilsneezy said:

Time outs don't really work for dogs since they live in the moment. If you want to train your dog not to do something then you have to stop the behavior BEFORE it happens. Punishing the dog after the fact isn't going to teach it anything. When you put a dog in a "time out" I can guarantee they're not sitting there thinking about what they did wrong. A dog doesn't rationalize its behavior like a human would. I agree with PP about teaching your dog how to take food gently, but you also have to look for what triggers the dog to grab food and what kind of behavior the dog exhibits right before he's about to do it (and then correct THAT behavior). For example, I can tell my dog is about to grab something if he's staring intently at it. Hold a cracker near your dog (don't tease him with it, just hold it where he can see it) and when you catch him focusing on it, that's when you firmly tell him "NO." Correcting the behavior before it happens will teach your dog how you want him to behave. Punishing him after the fact will just make him fear you.

Yes and no.  You're contradicting yourself.  If dogs lived so in the moment that they don't remember consequences of their actions, then they wouldn't be able to pick up any learned behavior.  They wouldn't know to be excited when their person came home every day because they would get a treat.  They wouldn't learn to be afraid of someone who abuses them.  Dogs do have an understanding of consequences and negative reinforcement does work when applied appropriately.  "Time outs" are generally considered a very effective training aide in conjunction with positive reinforcement

The idea is that removing a dog from something they want (ie- to be with people) when they exhibit a behavior that is undesirable (ie- being too assertive with an 11 month old, or jumping up on a person) reinforces that it is a bad behavior.  They learn this just as they learn to practice good behaviors when they get rewarded with something.

Of course dogs can be trained but you're wrong if you think your dog is sitting in his "time out" reflecting about how bad he was. Dogs do have an understanding of consequences, but that doesn't mean they feel guilt or have a moral code. 

[pismoduo]

Mar 2, 2015 21:21:32 GMT -5 lilsneezy said:

Mar 2, 2015 20:46:14 GMT -5 tromeo said:

Yes and no.  You're contradicting yourself.  If dogs lived so in the moment that they don't remember consequences of their actions, then they wouldn't be able to pick up any learned behavior.  They wouldn't know to be excited when their person came home every day because they would get a treat.  They wouldn't learn to be afraid of someone who abuses them.  Dogs do have an understanding of consequences and negative reinforcement does work when applied appropriately.  "Time outs" are generally considered a very effective training aide in conjunction with positive reinforcement

The idea is that removing a dog from something they want (ie- to be with people) when they exhibit a behavior that is undesirable (ie- being too assertive with an 11 month old, or jumping up on a person) reinforces that it is a bad behavior.  They learn this just as they learn to practice good behaviors when they get rewarded with something.

Of course dogs can be trained but you're wrong if you think your dog is sitting in his "time out" reflecting about how bad he was. Dogs do have an understanding of consequences, but that doesn't mean they feel guilt or have a moral code. 

The point is that if my dog does something I don't like, I shun him. Dog packs do the same thing. Of course he's not reflecting on his behavior. But being separated from the pack for that behavior is a very effective consequence. The term "time out" is just a cutesy way of saying that I shun/segregate him. Negative consequences, when done in the moment, are definitely effective.

[britts22]

Agree with bluebird44, huge thanks to everyone! I feel so much better now that I have some direction and know what to do with my little guy to get him ready for baby

[heatherj9603]

pismoduo,is right. Time outs only work when you catch them doing it. It's also useful when you command them to go away (go to your bed or something similar) I have four dogs who love being with people, so being forced to go away is not something they like. Once they realize that you'll send them away every time for that behavior, they'll figire it out quick to not do that behavior.

But a leave it command will be very useful. Practice with a treat. Place it in front of them and say leave it. If they go for it, push their nose back (not aggressively or forcefully, just a nudge) or put your hand over the treat. Remove your hand and again say leave it. Keep doing this until they leave it alone. They can stare at the treat, drool, what ever. Just can't eat it. Release with a command like go ahead, get the treat, etc. then praise praise praise!

It's also useful to make them stay before allowing them to eat. Make them sit in a spot or lay on their bed. Set the food down and don't allow them to eat Til you give your command to go ahead.

It took a good bit of training, but being a multi dog household it was a must. And my oldest was 9 when we started enforcing them to wait before eating. So you CAN teach an old dog new tricks.