NGKUR: Help me figure this out?

[akraus2015]

I think I might be late to this thread, but even if you've already hashed it out, this might be helpful for the future. I read a book called Crucial Conversations for a leadership program, and it literally changed my life, both personally and professionally. One of the biggest things I took away from it is how to set yourself up for a successful difficult conversation: CRIB.

There's a ton of useful information in this book, and I read it cover to cover in two days. It really helped my fiancé and me learn to communicate with each other.

I hope it all works out the way you both want it to!

Edit: spelling

[Lollipop]

I don't think I'm explaining myself well. I won't be adding money to this account until after we meet with Don and I'm added to it. I believe that it is some kind of high interest savings account, and was intended to be a college fund. The money in it at this point is 100% DH's, from before we were even dating. He stopped depositing into it when we were planning our wedding, because we had some unplanned expenses pop up. We intend to add me to the account, as well as do some other stuff (I think insurance stuff was mentioned), and then we will both start paying into the account again, at least until we are ready to buy a house.
We are putting off buying for another year, until we have all of this dealt with.

[Lollipop]

Mar 23, 2015 20:04:17 GMT -5 hippo said:

Mar 23, 2015 19:53:51 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

DH can have Don (that's the guy's name) transfer money from the one account into his everyday account. He's done it a couple of times, when we've had a big expense. I don't know anything about the account (even what it's called) to find out the balance. We are going to meet with Don soon, so I can get all of the necessary info. We can't spend directly from the account.

Ya, you really need to meet with Don and find out what your dealing with.  You say that YH doesn't think you'll be ready to buy a house for another year, but unless he actually knows what's in the account, how can he know if that's even attainable.   

FWIW, in the mean time I would have pushed for a washer/dryer over a dishwasher.  You can wash your dishes at home- by hand, but you need to go elsewhere to do your laundry.

H's worry is less about the down payment (we have an option to have a 0% down mortgage), and more about whether we can swing the mortgage payments and other bills (insurance, upkeep, etc)

As for the washer/dryer vs dishwasher, I despise washing dishes by hand, and we have no hook ups for laundry in our apartment. I don't mind dragging a couple of loads of laundry to my mom's house to wash them, sadly I can't do that with dishes. The dishwasher is a much bigger deal to me.

[juliayadda]

Mar 23, 2015 20:10:49 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

Mar 23, 2015 20:04:17 GMT -5 hippo said:

Ya, you really need to meet with Don and find out what your dealing with.  You say that YH doesn't think you'll be ready to buy a house for another year, but unless he actually knows what's in the account, how can he know if that's even attainable.   

FWIW, in the mean time I would have pushed for a washer/dryer over a dishwasher.  You can wash your dishes at home- by hand, but you need to go elsewhere to do your laundry.

H's worry is less about the down payment (we have an option to have a 0% down mortgage), and more about whether we can swing the mortgage payments and other bills (insurance, upkeep, etc)

As for the washer/dryer vs dishwasher, I despise washing dishes by hand, and we have no hook ups for laundry in our apartment. I don't mind dragging a couple of loads of laundry to my mom's house to wash them, sadly I can't do that with dishes. The dishwasher is a much bigger deal to me.

No you don't. AND YOU SHOULDN'T even if you could. 

[juliayadda]

Here is a link to the CMHC home buying guide.

It's a good read if you are planning to buy in the next year.

www.cmhc-schl.gc.ca/en/co/buho/

[Lollipop]

Mar 23, 2015 20:16:07 GMT -5 juliayadda said:

Mar 23, 2015 20:10:49 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

H's worry is less about the down payment (we have an option to have a 0% down mortgage), and more about whether we can swing the mortgage payments and other bills (insurance, upkeep, etc)

As for the washer/dryer vs dishwasher, I despise washing dishes by hand, and we have no hook ups for laundry in our apartment. I don't mind dragging a couple of loads of laundry to my mom's house to wash them, sadly I can't do that with dishes. The dishwasher is a much bigger deal to me.

No you don't. AND YOU SHOULDN'T even if you could. 

It is a possibility offered by a local mortgage broker, but we'd rather not take it. That's partly why we decided to rent for another year.

[helloerrbody]

When y'all used money from the account for the car did you not know then how much was there and how much was remaining after you took out that amount?

[Lollipop]

Mar 23, 2015 20:44:26 GMT -5 hippo said:

Mar 23, 2015 20:19:47 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

It is a possibility offered by a local mortgage broker, but we'd rather not take it. That's partly why we decided to rent for another year.

No there is no more option for 0 down in Canada.  There was years ago, but you pay a crazy amount on CMHC insurance.  If you are going through a broker and they say it's 0 down its not.  They will loan you the down payment, but the interest rate on that is obscene, and will add years to your mortgage.

That's exactly what it is. And we decided against it.

[Lollipop]

Mar 23, 2015 21:07:49 GMT -5 helloerrbody said:

When y'all used money from the account for the car did you not know then how much was there and how much was remaining after you took out that amount?

DH had a rough estimate of how much was in there before the car, and he knows how much he took out to pay for the car (I don't remember exactly) but I think he's forgotten the exact numbers in the 3.5 years since then. And I think there may be investments or something that effects the balance, but I'm not 100% sure.

[Lollipop]

Mar 23, 2015 21:07:52 GMT -5 @littleliverpill said:

Lollipop, I'm glad that you and YH were able to sit down and discuss the issue.

My $0.02 FWIW -- I would schedule a meeting to sit down with the financial adviser and discuss the specifics of that mystery account, like, yesterday. It seems like that would be step one and discussions on what percent of down payments on a house should be is step seventeen.

I hope now that you've had the discussion, you can both be proactive about taking the next steps together.

The mystery account isn't that important. I mean, there's some money in it, possibly enough for a down payment, but it wasn't the deciding factor. DH wants us to be able to handle the mortgage payments and bills before we buy. I was mistaken in thinking that we could do that right off the bat.

[icaughtfire]

How long have y'all been married?

[Lollipop]

Almost 4 years.

[icaughtfire]

Mar 23, 2015 21:25:29 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

Almost 4 years.

That's a long time for him to be too lazy to include you on that account.

[Lollipop]

Mar 23, 2015 21:27:09 GMT -5 icaughtfire said:

Mar 23, 2015 21:25:29 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

Almost 4 years.

That's a long time for him to be too lazy to include you on that account.

I agree, but I don't think it's a big deal, because the account has just been sitting there, inactive since 2011. The only reason it's comeuup now is because we were discussing buying a house. If we hadn't been talking about that it probably would've never come up, and neither of us would've thought about it.

[Lollipop]

Mar 23, 2015 21:29:31 GMT -5 @littleliverpill said:

Mar 23, 2015 21:17:00 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

The mystery account isn't that important. I mean, there's some money in it, possibly enough for a down payment, but it wasn't the deciding factor. DH wants us to be able to handle the mortgage payments and bills before we buy. I was mistaken in thinking that we could do that right off the bat.

I don't know your lyfe and all of that, but the bolded would qualify as "important" to me if I was considering buying a house.

I just meant that it wasn't really the point. It is important for the house buying conversation, obviously, but having a down payment wasn't DH's issue. There's no point in having a down payment if we can't pay the mortgage.

[helloerrbody]

Mar 23, 2015 21:35:05 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

Mar 23, 2015 21:29:31 GMT -5 @littleliverpill said:

I don't know your lyfe and all of that, but the bolded would qualify as "important" to me if I was considering buying a house.

I just meant that it wasn't really the point. It is important for the house buying conversation, obviously, but having a down payment wasn't DH's issue. There's no point in having a down payment if we can't pay the mortgage.

But you do realize that the amount of the down payment will directly affect the mortgage payments each month, right? So if there is a shitton of money in that account for a huge down payment, then you will be able to pay the mortgage and bills just fine.

[nachobutt]

Mar 23, 2015 21:35:05 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

Mar 23, 2015 21:29:31 GMT -5 @littleliverpill said:

I don't know your lyfe and all of that, but the bolded would qualify as "important" to me if I was considering buying a house.

I just meant that it wasn't really the point. It is important for the house buying conversation, obviously, but having a down payment wasn't DH's issue. There's no point in having a down payment if we can't pay the mortgage.

So you were pushing the issue on buying a house, when you couldn't even afford a mortgage to begin with? I'm so confused at this whole thread. Sounds to me you were just bitching because you wanted a house, and he said no. No zero down mortgage, no because it's not the right time, and you wanted to blame it on him and the money guy. Nope. Can we stop now?

[icaughtfire]

Mar 23, 2015 21:41:30 GMT -5 helloerrbody said:

Mar 23, 2015 21:35:05 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

I just meant that it wasn't really the point. It is important for the house buying conversation, obviously, but having a down payment wasn't DH's issue. There's no point in having a down payment if we can't pay the mortgage.

But you do realize that the amount of the down payment will directly affect the mortgage payments each month, right? So if there is a shitton of money in that account for a huge down payment, then you will be able to pay the mortgage and bills just fine.

Gurl, STAHP with the logic.

[Lollipop]

Mar 23, 2015 21:41:30 GMT -5 helloerrbody said:

Mar 23, 2015 21:35:05 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

I just meant that it wasn't really the point. It is important for the house buying conversation, obviously, but having a down payment wasn't DH's issue. There's no point in having a down payment if we can't pay the mortgage.

But you do realize that the amount of the down payment will directly affect the mortgage payments each month, right? So if there is a shitton of money in that account for a huge down payment, then you will be able to pay the mortgage and bills just fine.

Yes I do realize that. DH doesn't think there is much there right now. That's why he wants to work and save for another year before we buy.

I've explained as best I can, and I thank you allfor the advice. Obviously some of you have different opinions on what we should do, and Irespect tthat. What we are doing has worked up until now, and now that it isn't working, we're changing how we do things.

[Lollipop]

Mar 23, 2015 21:43:52 GMT -5 nachobutt said:

Mar 23, 2015 21:35:05 GMT -5 Lollipop said:

I just meant that it wasn't really the point. It is important for the house buying conversation, obviously, but having a down payment wasn't DH's issue. There's no point in having a down payment if we can't pay the mortgage.

So you were pushing the issue on buying a house, when you couldn't even afford a mortgage to being with? I'm so confused at this whole thread. Sounds to me you were just bitching because you wanted a house, and he said no. No zero down mortgage, no because it's not the right time, and you wanted to blame it on him and the money guy. Nope. Can we stop now?

I thought we would be able to afford the mortgage. I thought we just needed the down payment. It is possible to have a mortgage payment that is the same or less than what we currently pay for rent.

I was mistaken. DH would feel more comfortable if we had a larger down payment, leading to lower mortgage payments, and a little more breathing room.

[juliayadda]

Cough** property tax cough** utilities cough** mortgage insurance cough**

#doubleyourmortgagepaymentforarealisticcostofowningahome

#whyamibothering

[wanderingheart]

juliayadda I just love your long hashtags. #hashtagsforeverandeverandeverandever

[BrewGirl]

Mar 23, 2015 22:39:20 GMT -5 @littleliverpill said:

Mar 23, 2015 22:01:41 GMT -5 juliayadda said:

Cough** property tax cough** utilities cough** mortgage insurance cough**

#doubleyourmortgagepaymentforarealisticcostofowningahome

#whyamibothering

#OPyoushouldtalktoyourhusband

#thissituationseemssuspect

#mysteryfund

#whoisthemoneyguy

#wherecanigetamoneyguy

#readingallthisfinanceshithasgivenmeaheadacheandnowiamindesperateneedofaglassofwine



I think all posts should be in hashtags. #allpostsshoulddefinitelynotbeinhashtags

[pibblemom]

My newbie .02, coming from someone who also married into a "mystery account." When my DH and I first got engaged, I had known that he had a large investment account started by his parents when he was a baby, and invested into his whole life. While we were dating it was none of my business. When we moved in together, pre-engagement, it was still none of my business, however, because he is ALSO horrendous with finances, I handle all the finances. The week we decided to move in together, I made sure we opened a joint account. We each still have our own separate accounts too, but our joint account takes care of joint things (at the time rent, utilities, food, entertainment) and we each put in a set amount each week or pay period and the rest is ours to do what we want.

The "mystery" account only came up in conversation between my MIL and I when we started talking about buying a home around the time we got engaged. DH never even knew how much was in it so of course he couldn't tell me about it. MIL told me there was enough for a down payment in it, but FIL seemed to really push the "save it for retirement" route. I never asked for an exact figure, ad never got one until our first year filing taxes as a married couple. We saved our own down payment, I figured out a weekly and monthly budget and we lived tight for 2 years in a condo saving, but it was very worth knowing that we didn't have to use what was originally planned as a retirement fund for our home, and the saving and living on a budget was great practice for what it's actually like in a home.

I like what someone else said, take your mortgage payment and double it, yeah.. That's accurate.

Another tip my dad gave me was to make sure your mortgage payment is less than 20% of your take home pay each month, in the US that includes taxes and insurance. When he told me I thought no way that could be accurate, maybe we could stretch it to 25%. Don't do it. 20% or less, because shit happens very quickly owning a home.

[Lollipop]

Mar 24, 2015 10:53:02 GMT -5 @pineappleoranges said:

Mar 23, 2015 23:34:57 GMT -5 pibblemom said:

My newbie .02, coming from someone who also married into a "mystery account." When my DH and I first got engaged, I had known that he had a large investment account started by his parents when he was a baby, and invested into his whole life. While we were dating it was none of my business. When we moved in together, pre-engagement, it was still none of my business, however, because he is ALSO horrendous with finances, I handle all the finances. The week we decided to move in together, I made sure we opened a joint account. We each still have our own separate accounts too, but our joint account takes care of joint things (at the time rent, utilities, food, entertainment) and we each put in a set amount each week or pay period and the rest is ours to do what we want.

The "mystery" account only came up in conversation between my MIL and I when we started talking about buying a home around the time we got engaged. DH never even knew how much was in it so of course he couldn't tell me about it. MIL told me there was enough for a down payment in it, but FIL seemed to really push the "save it for retirement" route. I never asked for an exact figure, ad never got one until our first year filing taxes as a married couple. We saved our own down payment, I figured out a weekly and monthly budget and we lived tight for 2 years in a condo saving, but it was very worth knowing that we didn't have to use what was originally planned as a retirement fund for our home, and the saving and living on a budget was great practice for what it's actually like in a home.

I like what someone else said, take your mortgage payment and double it, yeah.. That's accurate.

Another tip my dad gave me was to make sure your mortgage payment is less than 20% of your take home pay each month, in the US that includes taxes and insurance. When he told me I thought no way that could be accurate, maybe we could stretch it to 25%. Don't do it. 20% or less, because shit happens very quickly owning a home.

The difference is she has been asking for information on the account. The difference is she knows nothing about what is going on in the account. The "money guy" won't discuss the account with her, she apparently doesn't get statements for this account. The account may be empty but the fact that the information was being withheld was what sounded worrisome.

Dropping some anecdotes: When I got added to my husbands savings account, he had .62 in there. I had seen statements knowing the account existed and he spoke about adding me to it for months before we got it done. Every relationship is different though and it sounds like OP just wanted a dishwasher and not necessarily a house.

I do want a house. Just one with a dishwasher. I hate renting. I'm sick of not being able to change anything in my home. DH feels that we aren't ready to buy, and I agree now that he's explained his reasons. I was acting like a spoiled brat. DH doesn't fully understand where I'm coming from, as we had very different upbringings. We decided to get a dishwasher in the meantime, because neither of us likes doing dishes.

[icaughtfire]

<----- has a dishwasher, doing dishes still sucks.

[longhornwino0907]

Mar 24, 2015 12:54:05 GMT -5 icaughtfire said:

<----- has a dishwasher, doing dishes still sucks.

#truestory

#Iwouldratherusepaperplates

#thatsbadfortheenvironment

#thestruggleisreal

[Lollipop]

Mar 24, 2015 13:11:22 GMT -5 longhornwino0907 said:

Mar 24, 2015 12:54:05 GMT -5 icaughtfire said:

<----- has a dishwasher, doing dishes still sucks.

#truestory

#Iwouldratherusepaperplates

#thatsbadfortheenvironment

#thestruggleisreal

My mom used paper plates all weekend. She has a dishwasher, she just didn't want to bother while she had company.
I keep telling DH we should just use paper plates, the environment be damned.

[mynameiscarrie]

Mar 24, 2015 13:27:19 GMT -5 @emilie818 said:

I'm seeing this thread late, but Lollipop, this all sounds shady as hell. How can your DH have an account and not know how much is in it? How can you be married to him for 4 years and not know either? That is prime territory for a "financial advisor" to be fucking you over in some way, be it big or small. You're married. Even if you call it "his money", his money = your money. As someone who is married to him, and as someone who has a child, it is your responsibility to know in accurate and non-shady terms what your assets are and how they are managed. Especially since you're thinking of buying a home.

Lurking but +1 to all of this....

Even if he is lazy, it is your responsibility to pick up that slack and make him not lazy. You can't be passive and expect things to go the way you want them to, especially when it comes to finances. Shady account is shady. Buying a house isn't a "well, I guess we could swing it so let's go for it" type thing. You need to really sit down and assess not just if you can afford it but if you're actually ready for homeownership because you can't wait 4 years to call the roof guy if there's a leak.

[ironbaby]

I work in the "investments" field. Legally, the rep cannot tell you anything, whether he has met you or not, if you are not listed on the account as an account holder. MAKE SURE you get access to that account by putting it in joint name.

Statements are generally mailed out quarterly if there is no activity (interest is not an "activity" and you should certainly be seeing at the very least an annual statement and an interest tax document.

This all is very, very sketchy of your husband. He has made you feel small for wanting a home, for "not understanding" what you could/could not afford, and that is not healthy. More conversations need to be happening. Soon. By the time H and I started shopping for homes, we knew EXACTLY how much house we could afford for what we wanted to spend in a mortgage payment (including taxes and insurance), and we determine what that payment could be based on our income, the 20% idea, and how our current rent affected our monthly finances.