Where are my toddler mommas?

[ksyknelvr73]

Is he in a crib? Or a toddler/regular bed?

I know that I am lucky, but our toddler never really had much issues with sleep - however, he did start having nightmares at one point and he would wake up crying, etc. He was already in the "toddler" bed (still his crib but converted with the rail) at the age your toddler is, so he could get up and come in our room.

Honestly, what we did was: get him a night light, and put a gate on his door so he couldn't go out of his room anymore. If he woke up crying, I'd go in there and kind of tell him it's okay, we're here, and then rub his back and put him right back down to bed and walk out. I don't know how much help that is.

How long has he been doing this? I wish I had some better advice, I just feel like it might be a phase and something you have to keep talking through. Even talk to him during the day when he is not sleeping about things and reassure him that he's fine and you are there, and there's nothing scary going on.

Again, I know we went through something similar, but it was temporary - although now I can't remember just how temporary.

[bliz1712]

Does he do well with directions? A lot of Mom's from my other BMB use a "ok to wake" alarm clock. Basically you set it so that the color turns a specific color for when it's ok to get up. Some of them had LOs getting up at 4-5 and this got them to sleep until 630-7. I think they found it on Amazon.  I think you could probably use it for naps.  I don't have any personal experience with it.

I'm not sure how to help with the night screaming.  If he's having dreams or nightmares it could be why he's waking up.  I think around this age they begin to remember their dreams so it may be hard to go back to sleep for them when they wake up from one.

[bliz1712]

Could you talk to him about the dreams if it is that? If you can get it out of him what they are about you could go about discussing how xyz is ok or ways to make them not as scary.

[Deleted]

I've been reading Weissbluth again recently and here's the excerpt on Months 22-36, in relation to nap issues. Hopefully the spoiler works because this is a huge chunk of text!

Months Twenty-two to Thirty-six: Only a Single Afternoon Nap

Naps

At twenty-four months of age, only 5 percent of children have two naps and 95 percent are taking a single afternoon nap. By thirty-six months of age, no children are taking two naps, 91 percent are taking a single nap in the afternoon, and 9 percent are not napping at all. A common problem occurs when the nap disappears but the child appears very tired during the day and really seems to need to nap. The closer the child is to his second birthday, the more likely you should try to reestablish the nap, because most probably it is biologically needed. But if he is almost three, you might not be as successful in reestablishing the nap because he might have outgrown the need for it.

Here are two plans to try to reestablish a nap:

SPOILER: Click to show

 

SPOILER: Click to show

First, consider the situation where the bedtime is already quite early or you observe that when you moved the bedtime earlier it only caused your child to get up earlier in the morning. Try to slowly move the bedtime later by about twenty to thirty minutes each night with“the hope that your child will sleep in later, wake up better rested, and be more able to take an afternoon nap. Second, if the bedtime is quite late, move “the bedtime slowly earlier by about twenty to thirty minutes each night with the hope that your child will wake up better rested. In either case, try intensive stimulation in the morning, followed by a wind-down, then a prolonged prenap soothing routine, and try to nap him when he’s tired but not too overtired. Consider lying down with your child in your bed temporarily, mother or father, to reestablish the nap routine. After five to seven days, reevaluate and make adjustments of bedtimes and nap times.

Between twenty-two and thirty-six months, most children still need to nap. The average amount of daytime sleep at thirty-six months is about two hours. But there is much individual variation; the range is from one to three and a half hours. If your child is at either extreme of this range, ask yourself if he appears well rested at all times.

The majority (80 percent) of children between the ages of two and three years have a nap length in a narrower band between one and a half to two and a half hours. Most children nap for about two hours. The model nap duration is two hours between “ the ages of two and six years. The stability of the two-hour nap over different ages is another argument for a strong biological influence over sleep, but it does not necessarily mean that your child needs a two-hour nap. Some children need less and some need more daytime sleep.

Fears

Nightmares, monsters, fear of separation, fear of darkness, fear of death, fear of abandonment … don’t fears cause disturbed sleep at this age? Many experts tell us that night fears are common among children between two and four years old. Thunderstorms, barking dogs, loud trucks, and many other events over which we have no control can frighten children. If your child has been a good sleeper up to now, you should expect any disturbed sleep triggered by these events to be short-lived.
Some child care experts believe severe sleep disturbances are caused by night fears. Usually, though, children with serious sleep problems did not sleep well at younger ages, and their current difficulty is simply misinterpreted as caused by an age-appropri“ate concern or “stage.”

Reassurance, frequent curtain calls, open doors, night-lights, or a longer bedtime routine will help your child get over his fears. My recommendation is to spend extra time soothing your child to sleep or go to him once for reassurance, but use a kitchen timer to control the duration of the extra time. The timer is set to the number of minutes you want to spend with your child and is then placed under a pillow or cushion to muffle the noise. Tell your child that when the buzzer or bell sounds, you will kiss him and leave. The child learns to associate the sound of the time with your departure and learns that this signals the end of your hugging, massage, or lullabies. This is called “stimulus control,” which is discussed further in Chapter 9. Just as when the final curtain call ends, you know the play is really over, or just as you know to slow down as the green light turns to yellow, your child learns to associate the sound with the end of your soothing effort. Because crying will not bring you back, the crying ends.

If your child has never been a good sleeper and now also appears during the day to be extremely frightened, withdrawn in new surroundings, shy, or fearful, then it is very difficult for parents to give less attention at night, even if the goal is to enhance consolidated sleep. If this is the case with your toddler, a child psychologist can give you good advice on where to draw the line between supporting the child and encouraging him to learn to overcome his fears.

Routines and Schedules

At about two to three years of age, although most children in my research survey go to sleep between 7:00 and 9:00 P.M. and awaken between 6:30 and 8:00 A.M., I think that an earlier bedtime is better. A single nap between one and three hours occurs in over 90 percent of children. Try to be reasonably regular about nap time and bedtime, and be consistent in your bedtime rituals. There are no absolute, rigid, or firm rules, because every day is somewhat different. Reasonable regularity and consistency implies reasonable flexibility. Be aware that your lifestyle helps or hinders your child’s sleep patterns, and remember that there will be changes due to growth and rearrangements in relationships within the family.

How about scheduled, organized activities that take place when your child needs to take her afternoon nap? If she is unable to take her afternoon nap two or three times each week and you are able to get an extra-early bedtime on those days, then there may be no problem, as long as the child is sleeping well in general. For the child who is not sleeping well, for whatever reason, losing a few naps can be quite problematic. Also keep in mind that children are likely to pick up minor illnesses from each other in group settings, and not feeling well may disrupt your child’s sleep and push her into an overtired state. In general, be cautious. Have fun with your child, but occasionally have what my wife called a “declared holiday.” Missing a swim class, gym class, or any other preschool event now and then because your child is tired and needs to nap, or leaving soon after you arrive because the other children look sick will not jeopardize your child’s college plans!

A Regular Bed and the Arrival of a New Baby

One rearrangement is moving your child to a “big kid’s” bed. There is no special age when you should make this change. As long as the crib is large enough, you should not feel that your child must be placed in a regular bed by a certain age. Many parents make the switch around the second or third birthday. Let your child ask for a big bed. One mother described how she felt that she had made the move too soon and the big bed must have seemed “oceanic” compared to the crib, because her son always slept curled up in one corner of the bed—that is, when he slept. He slept better when returned to his crib. Before she made the move “back to the crib, his mother wondered whether this would cause a “regression” in her child. It did not. But it did result in a better-rested family.

If the move to a regular bed is needed because of a new baby brother or sister, consider making the move when the newborn is about four months old. By then, the newborn has regular sleeping habits. Before the baby reaches this age, there is a constant shifting of household routines due to the infant’s naturally irregular sleep pattern. This may cause confusion or insecurity in the older child because he does not know when mom or dad will be available, or why he has to wait when he wants to go outside and has been used to doing just that. When the newborn is four months old and her sleep pattern is stable, events in the house are much more predictable. The older child now becomes adjusted to the new family arrangements. The baby goes to the crib and the older child graduates with pride to the big bed for big kids. He does not feel displaced. Before the newborn is actually moved from the bassinet to the crib, feelfree to leave the crib up and empty for a while with the understanding that if the older child gets out of bed once, then it’s back to the crib. “it did result in a better-rested family.

If the move to a regular bed is needed because of a new baby brother or sister, consider making the move when the newborn is about four months old. By then, the newborn has regular sleeping habits. Before the baby reaches this age, there is a constant shifting of household routines due to the infant’s naturally irregular sleep pattern. This may cause confusion or insecurity in the older child because he does not know when mom or dad will be available, or why he has to wait when he wants to go outside and has been used to doing just that. When the newborn is four months old and her sleep pattern is stable, events in the house are much more predictable. The older child now becomes adjusted to the new family arrangements. The baby goes to the crib and the older child graduates with pride to the big bed for big kids. He does not feel displaced. Before the newborn is actually moved from the bassinet to the crib, feel free to leave the crib up and empty for a while with the understanding that if the older child gets “out of bed once, then it’s back to the crib.

Moving to a big bed too early, before the birth of the new baby, often invites a problem: The commotion and excitement surrounding the arrival of a new “baby creates confusion or insecurity in the older child, who may call out or cry at night. The more difficult situation is when the older child starts to get up every night to visit his parents.

If the move to a regular bed prompts frequent nocturnal visits, curtain calls, calls for help going to the bathroom, or calls for a drink of water, think before you act. A habit may slowly develop in which your child learns to expect you to spend more time with her, putting her to sleep or returning her to sleep. Imagine what would occur if a baby-sitter gave your two-year-old candy every day instead of a real lunch. Once you discovered this, you would immediately stop the candy for meals. Your child might protest and cry, but would you give in and let her have the candy? No. If you are spending too much time at night with your child when she should be sleeping, consider what you are doing to be “social candy”—not needed and not healthy for the child. Be firm in your resolve to ignore the expected protest from your child when you change your behavior.

SPOILER: Click to show

[/spoiler]

[Deleted]

^^ i think you have to click to show the spoiler a few times -- also, from some of that it looks like you were doing the right thing with moving bedtime earlier, but maybe just needed to go a bit earlier than that?

[ksyknelvr73]

Oh yeah - baby wakeups are not near as frustrating as the toddler ones. I have way more patience with the baby.

I really, really do think it is a phase. I have been trying so hard to remember when we went through that but I know it was temporary. Of course, in the moment, it feels like an eternity.

[SpinsOffResonance]

We had so many sleep issues with DD1 after the baby was born. The worst was between 18-22momths. She's 2y2m now and we're in a good spot again. But before she was fighting naps and bedtime like crazy. Basically she was scared to be alone at bedtime. Whereas before we could do her bedtime routine and leave her to fall asleep alone, now we had to sit with her until she fell asleep. At first it was just 15 or 30min but it started taking longer and longer until I was sitting in her room for 2 hours every night. At that point DH just started sleeping in her room instead.. He did that for a few months. Then one day he told her he was going to go sleep in mommy's bed and she had to sleep in her own bed, wished her goodnight, left and she was okay with it.out of nowhere, it worked.

When she started fighting naps, I would get in the bed with her and hold her in the bed until she was asleep. Sometimes it would take up to an hour. But if I didn't she would not nap at all, and she really needs the nap. Then, one day, same as bedtime I toldnher I was going to go nap in my bed and she had to nap in her bed, left her there and it worked.

So I guess my approach with sleep issues is that it's all a phase. do whatever it takes to get the toddler to sleep. Then once in a while try changing it back and see if it works.

[aimeefarrahfowler]

To help with the stalling there's a book that's worked for a lot of the moms in my other group. I think it's called the sleep fairy, you can buy it on amazon. You read the story of the sleep fairy to LO and when they go straight to bed with no stalling the sleep fairy visits and leaves a small reward under their pillow. Eventually it re-wires them to go straight to sleep and you don't have to keep doing the rewards.

[danabsd]

Do you think him not getting enough sleep in general is part of the cycle? Like if he were to stay asleep all night for a night it would make a difference? If so have you ever given a little children's Benadryl? People can throw their flame balls but we've done it in the past for wake ups to break the cycle. It would only take a night of not wakin out of habit to get back to normal.

[danabsd]

When mine doesn't nap she's up hours earlier than when she's well napped. It's terrible.

[ho11yday]

DS1 still wakes up crying sometimes but normally puts himself back to sleep. However, getting the night light helped both the screaming at bedtime and the amount of crying at night. DH will also sometimes get him out of bed, watch an episode of adventure time (15 minutes), and put him back to bed.

[ho11yday]

Only thing about benadryl: be careful. In some people (toddlers are more prone) it had the opposite effect of causing wakefulness. Try it at nap first instead of at bedtime

[jerssey]

We have the same issue going on here for the last two weeks. DD is almost 3 and wakes up screaming. Just wants to have me with her to sleep. Between her and DS teething craziness waking up 6 times a night, i barely sleep these days. Getting frustrating. Hope it is all just a short phase that works itself out for us all!

[ns1]

Sorry you're going through this. DD had some sleep issues after the baby was born (mostly peeing on the floor though...), but they've cleared up now (she's 3 yrs. 3 months). I don't have much advice, just wanted to offer commiseration. We also got the OK to wake alarm clock, but it's junk for us. If it's not green when DD wants to wake up she just tells us it's broken, plus it's really easy for her to get to the setting buttons to press them.

Also, as others have said, getting DD to bed before she gets overtired is key!

[ho11yday]

ns1 when did DD stop peeing on the floor? I swear ds1 pees on the floor to be spiteful. What did you do to end it?

[ns1]

Honestly I just think she stopped on her own. I'm pretty sure it was spite for her too. She stopped after maybe 4-6 months of starting it I think. We tried giving her a sticker if she didn't do it; ignoring it; talking to her about it. She had good nights and bad nights until she finally stopped. Someone mentioned to have her stay with grandparents if possible to see if that would break it, and I want to say that when my parents were down for a visit she actually didn't pee on the floor, so maybe that helped too. I'm not sure what finally did it though. Just time I guess? Sorry to hear you get to deal with that - it's definitely not fun, especially on top of everything else you have going on. ho11yday

[ho11yday]

ns1 is more of am annoyance than anything and I'm getting tired of steam cleaning his bedroom floor. Well fx it ends soon.

[ns1]

ho11yday yeah - I had the resolve and scrub brush on hand at all times during this phase. It was just part of the morning/mid-night ritual.