Post by baileybaileybne on Jul 12, 2015 11:29:21 GMT -5
Has anyone experienced another round of engorgement? LO is 4 weeks on Tuesday and my right breast has become huge and so sore! I would be worried about mastitis if I hadn't just finished antibiotics today for my uterus infection. It's so hard and full and still he'd and sore after she's fed on that side. Thoughts?
Has anyone experienced another round of engorgement? LO is 4 weeks on Tuesday and my right breast has become huge and so sore! I would be worried about mastitis if I hadn't just finished antibiotics today for my uterus infection. It's so hard and full and still he'd and sore after she's fed on that side. Thoughts?
We are at 3 weeks today and the last 24 hours have been so painful thanks to engorgement. Im hoping kiddo ups his intake - this started after a day of cluster feeding so here's hoping. He's been pretty sleepy since then.
Baby girl was bobbing on my chest when she was on her tummy so I tried the natural breastfeeding - she's currently going to town! Such an easy and pain free latch!
I tried the natural nursing thing once yesterday and it was so frustrating! I have really big saggy boobs so I had a really hard time trying to help him latch. Going to try again when I'm better rested.
I tried the natural nursing thing once yesterday and it was so frustrating! I have really big saggy boobs so I had a really hard time trying to help him latch. Going to try again when I'm better rested.
It's definitely a two person job the first few times. MH usually helps position LO for me, and it goes way better. Did you watch the videos on YouTube? They have one that specifically addresses issues that women with larger breasts may encounter. It was helpful for me to see someone with big boobs actually do it.
baileybaileybne that would make sense at four weeks since they work to build supply during the three week growth spurt.
My thoughts too. Especially if LO is in the sleeping stage of the growth spurt.
Feel so uninformed about this stuff: there is a sleeping stage of a growth spurt? Do you mean she sleeps between frequent feeds? Cause she woke every hour last night...
Has anyone experienced another round of engorgement? LO is 4 weeks on Tuesday and my right breast has become huge and so sore! I would be worried about mastitis if I hadn't just finished antibiotics today for my uterus infection. It's so hard and full and still he'd and sore after she's fed on that side. Thoughts?
Yes! I've been so engorged the last few days (more so than usual) and its been so painful & frustrating. Mine has also been worse on the right side. After reading others responses, I guess a growth spurt makes sense but I really haven't noticed any signs of a growth spurt other than a little bit of increased fussiness yesterday and a 6 hour stretch of sleep last night. I have been debating pumping to relieve some of the pain but I don't want to make it worse.
ETA: LO is also going to be 4 weeks on Tuesday.
A hot shower and some hand expression would help relieve some pressure without triggering more production, unlike pumping which could exacerbate the problem.
My thoughts too. Especially if LO is in the sleeping stage of the growth spurt.
Feel so uninformed about this stuff: there is a sleeping stage of a growth spurt? Do you mean she sleeps between frequent feeds? Cause she woke every hour last night...
They grow in their sleep. My understanding is they'll eat eat eat and then sleep sleep sleep. It may be more noticeable as they're older. But after a few days of crazy cluster feeding, LO was just very sleepy and did longer (daytime) stretches. So I was engorged waiting for her to wake up to eat.
Post by ravinraven216 on Jul 12, 2015 20:35:49 GMT -5
I'm ready to throw in the towel. I'm going to try to see an LC in person this week because even after changing positions, self-expressing, etc. LO is still clamping down so hard I'm in so much pain I'm sobbing every time I nurse. It makes me angry at myself, resentful of LO, and generally overwhelmed. I'm experiencing a lot of symptoms of PPD, which I'm also seeking treatment for, and they all stem from the struggles of breastfeeding.
I'm about to call it quits. I've tried cookies/muffins, Gatorade, extra water, fenugreek, another lactation boosting supplement, oatmeal for breakfast& lunch, nothing is helping with my supply. Yes I know little man can get more than the pump but he's 6 weeks old and when I solely pump I'm lucky if I can get one ounce from both sides combined, little man is eating four ounces at a time now. To top it off little man is refusing to latch on the right side to nurse (it doesn't matter which way I hold him) and it's a fight to get him to latch on the left. He's upset and screaming, I get frustrated and upset and there's really not much hubs can do but give him a bottle while I get even more pissed off and go pump in another room. We had weight gaining issues a few weeks ago, so his pedi wanted me to nurse 10 min each side and then give him a bottle of formula and to let him eat as much of I as he wanted. He was born at 7.4 dropped to 6.14 in hospital, back up to 7.2ish at 4 days old, dropped to 6.10 at his appointment about 9 days later, new pedi weighed him the following week and he was down to 6.6 (cue freaking out FTM emotions). 4 days later we were back up to 7.2 (because I nursed for 20 min and then gave him a 3+ oz bottle). Thanks for letting me vent!!
I'm ready to throw in the towel. I'm going to try to see an LC in person this week because even after changing positions, self-expressing, etc. LO is still clamping down so hard I'm in so much pain I'm sobbing every time I nurse. It makes me angry at myself, resentful of LO, and generally overwhelmed. I'm experiencing a lot of symptoms of PPD, which I'm also seeking treatment for, and they all stem from the struggles of breastfeeding.
Girl, I have had the exact same feelings/thoughts/frustrations about BF as you 100 times this past month! Breastfeeding is HARD. Jusf know that you're doing a great job, but you need to do what's best for you and that's ok! (Because what's best for you is what is best for baby!) Good luck with whichever way you end up going:)
Post by billyhorrible on Jul 13, 2015 2:47:56 GMT -5
sabrinaml- it doesn't sound like you have supply problems, it sounds like you have pediatrician problems. Yours is giving you bad advice which is making the situation worse. My SIL had a similar issue.
Your problem is a combination of the 6 week groWth spurt, where everyone feels like their LO can't get enough, combined with nipple preference from offering a bottle. Having you supplement early/often means your LO gets frustrated when milk from the breast doesn't come as quickly as milk from a bottle. He doesn't want to have to work for it. And since your doctor had you limiting nursing, you weren't getting the signal to produce more/he wasn't building the muscles/strength to help his nursing.
If I were in your shoes, I'd do a power nursing day. Make a bed on the couch (or bed). Don't put on a shirt on you or your baby. Do chest to chest, letting him nurse all day/constantly - whenever he's awake.
sabrinaml- it doesn't sound like you have supply problems, it sounds like you have pediatrician problems. Yours is giving you bad advice which is making the situation worse. My SIL had a similar issue.
Your problem is a combination of the 6 week groWth spurt, where everyone feels like their LO can't get enough, combined with nipple preference from offering a bottle. Having you supplement early/often means your LO gets frustrated when milk from the breast doesn't come as quickly as milk from a bottle. He doesn't want to have to work for it. And since your doctor had you limiting nursing, you weren't getting the signal to produce more/he wasn't building the muscles/strength to help his nursing.
If I were in your shoes, I'd do a power nursing day. Make a bed on the couch (or bed). Don't put on a shirt on you or your baby. Do chest to chest, letting him nurse all day/constantly - whenever he's awake.
I'll try it tomorrow since I have to work today. This is our second pediatrician and they are way better than the first. When little man would/was actually nursing I think he used me more for a pacifier than to eat. Reason I think I have supply issues is because even when he was only 2/3 weeks old his little tummy would still growl after spending 40+ minutes nursing, basically like he never even ate. (This was when we transitioned pediatricians.) when I supplemented during the first 3 weeks he was spoon fed formula. By week 3 I couldn't handle it anymore and introduced a bottle. My mom did some research and found that having a c-section can mess with your supply because of certain hormones not being released or released later after birth. I also suffered from HELLP (which is why little man was born at 36.4) and HELLP can cause supply issues too.
Post by billyhorrible on Jul 13, 2015 9:39:40 GMT -5
sabrinaml,the hungry/during nursing thing is reallly common. I think the best analogy is celery. I don't know if it's true or not, but I remember hearing that it takes more calories to chew/eat/digest celery than celery has, so it's like a negative calorie food. When your little guy nurses for 40 minutes, he's also burning calories, and nursing for so long means he's burning through them almost as fast as you're providing them. But as they get older/stronger, they become more efficient at eating, it doesn't take as long, and they burn less calories, so they can store some for a little longer (but breastmilk still gets burned up fairly quickly, which is why breastfed babies eat more often than formula-fed).
You've had it rough between the HELLP, C-section, and pre-term baby. Not that breastfeeding is ever "easy" (and don't let anyone tell you otherwise. It's easier for some, but everyone has some challenges) but you've definitely had a harder path. Anytime you feel down, you should give yourself a little pep-talk. You've done AMAZING overcoming all of that. 6 weeks is longer than many people would have lasted given those obstacles. You're super-woman!
Post by nerdbeast23 on Jul 13, 2015 14:35:33 GMT -5
I have a quick question about thrush and pumped milk. My son has thrush and isn't on meds for it yet; we have a doctors appointment tomorrow. I have no signs of having thrush but I know its common for us both to have it if one of us does. At this point he isn't eating as well and I need to pump to be comfortable and keep up my supply, but can I save that milk or do I need to dump it to prevent reinfecting him in the future?
I have a quick question about thrush and pumped milk. My son has thrush and isn't on meds for it yet; we have a doctors appointment tomorrow. I have no signs of having thrush but I know its common for us both to have it if one of us does. At this point he isn't eating as well and I need to pump to be comfortable and keep up my supply, but can I save that milk or do I need to dump it to prevent reinfecting him in the future?
I believe that you can use it from the fridge, but can NOT freeze it. Anybody who's battled thrush have the answer?
I have a quick question about thrush and pumped milk. My son has thrush and isn't on meds for it yet; we have a doctors appointment tomorrow. I have no signs of having thrush but I know its common for us both to have it if one of us does. At this point he isn't eating as well and I need to pump to be comfortable and keep up my supply, but can I save that milk or do I need to dump it to prevent reinfecting him in the future?
Thrush has nothing to do with your milk. It's a topical yeast infection, like a rash. So your milk is fine.
I have a quick question about thrush and pumped milk. My son has thrush and isn't on meds for it yet; we have a doctors appointment tomorrow. I have no signs of having thrush but I know its common for us both to have it if one of us does. At this point he isn't eating as well and I need to pump to be comfortable and keep up my supply, but can I save that milk or do I need to dump it to prevent reinfecting him in the future?
Thrush has nothing to do with your milk. It's a topical yeast infection, like a rash. So your milk is fine.
Thanks for responding; I'm relieved I won't have to dump it!
Yeah it is best to USE any milk you pump while you have thrush before you finish the treatment for thrush. The yeast spores can be in the milk you pump and basically "reinfect" yourself if you use frozen 'thrushy" milk later after you are clear from thrush.
However, yeast lives naturally on our skin. It's always there. The beneficial bacteria plus our good immune system keeps it in check. When our immune system is out of wack, sometimes right after labor, or for baby having an immature immune system, or if we have antibiotics that kills off beneficial bacteria, the yeast on our skin gets out of control and we get a yeast overgrowth. it happens with breastfeeding because yeast loves sugar, and breastmilk is sugary. so the yeast eats sugary breastmilk and pees basically alcohol which burns the nipple tissue and baby's mouth. This is further a problem if you get cracked and damaged nips casue it gives little cracks and crevices for the yeast to take hold and grow in a warm moist environment.
So once treatment for yeast is past, you still have some residual yeast living in you and baby's body, so if you give milk pumped while you had thrush, it's just a little bit extra yeast spores and shouldn't be a problem if everything is healthy in both of your systems. But yeast/thrush hurts, it can set baby off of wanting to eat, it burns nips, it's hard to get rid of, so lots of moms just feel it's too much of a risk to use "thrushy" pumped milk if you don't have to. In theory you could scald the milk like you do for high lipase and it should kill the yeast (heat kills yeast) but that's a pita.
Much easier is to not pump when you have thrush, or if you do, go ahead and use the milk if possible. If you freeze the milk pumped when you have thrush, mark the bag so you may want to use just a little bit of it at a time, spread out over months, when you are sure you have no lingering yeast/thrush issues.
I definitely have been there with being ready to call it quits. I am six weeks 4 days PP and it has been incredibly rough. I am still in quite a bit of pain and my support people haven't really been able to definitively figure out why. We went from bad latch to thrush to maybe bad latch to where we are at now which is a reynauds/vasospasm diagnosis. No idea if I spelled either of those right but essentially it means my poor circulation in my extremities is present in my nipples so when LO latches on he cuts off my circulation. My nipples turn white and when he comes off blood rushes in and it's insanely painful and the pain never goes away. Also unlike yeast where you are supposed to air everything out with reynauds you are supposed to keep them covered and use heat. So everything I had been doing was just making my pain worse. Air conditioning and freezer sections of the grocery store and getting out of the shower make me want to cry. I'm not sure thrush and bad latch aren't also going on so in treating for those too. I'm on meds for the thrush, hypertension meds for the reynauds, and just started the mini pill because Lord I don't know if I could ever do this again but I know I can't do it now! I also paid 69 dollars at a compounding pharmacy for the all purpose cream and it was worth it because it definitely seems to help. And LO is going to a pediatric chiropractor today for an evaluation on latch and tongue tie and musculature. I am hitting this from every angle I can think of. If things don't improve considerably within a week I am likely going to be done myself. I can honestly say I tried everything to keep it going and it just didn't work out. It would be one thing if it just were my pain...that I can deal with. My Little ones frustration however with what seems like latch issues where he pulls off, tries to feed, and then let's out heatwrenching screams cannot be doing him any good long term.
Check and recheck latch and for tongue tie, multiple people have them look, more than one IBCLCL.
Lots of those issues arise from a tongue tie issue or latch problem.
Reynaulds/vasospasms tend to occur in conjunction with damage to the nipple from a poor latch or sometimes due to thrush. It resolves usually when the latch is corrected and damage heals, which may take a bit longer than a week, sorry. Get a pediatric dentist, and/or ENT to check for tongue tie, and lip tie I've never seen a chiropractor do that, they aren't trained to correct ties.
Be sure you are using a warmed rice sock in your bra immediately after nursing to help with pain from the cold.
How is supply? Are you spraying out milk fast and baby is clamping down to control the flow?
I'm about to call it quits. I've tried cookies/muffins, Gatorade, extra water, fenugreek, another lactation boosting supplement, oatmeal for breakfast& lunch, nothing is helping with my supply. Yes I know little man can get more than the pump but he's 6 weeks old and when I solely pump I'm lucky if I can get one ounce from both sides combined, little man is eating four ounces at a time now. To top it off little man is refusing to latch on the right side to nurse (it doesn't matter which way I hold him) and it's a fight to get him to latch on the left. He's upset and screaming, I get frustrated and upset and there's really not much hubs can do but give him a bottle while I get even more pissed off and go pump in another room. We had weight gaining issues a few weeks ago, so his pedi wanted me to nurse 10 min each side and then give him a bottle of formula and to let him eat as much of I as he wanted. He was born at 7.4 dropped to 6.14 in hospital, back up to 7.2ish at 4 days old, dropped to 6.10 at his appointment about 9 days later, new pedi weighed him the following week and he was down to 6.6 (cue freaking out FTM emotions). 4 days later we were back up to 7.2 (because I nursed for 20 min and then gave him a 3+ oz bottle). Thanks for letting me vent!!
The pediatrician's advice to nurse on only 10 minutes on each side followed by all the formula they wanted really screwed you up. It's fixable but it needs a concerted effort with lots of supports.
It's also a matter of a lot of the issue you have going on is that he's preferring the bottle and not nursing.
If I had been given the order to only pump I would have weaned from nursing completely rather than nursing my kids for 50 months combined, cause I don't let down for the pump. Pumps can be helpful but they can also seriously compromise supply if type of pump is wrong for the situation (hospital rental is best), if the horns are too large or too small, if you pump at too high of a setting or if you struggle to relax and let down milk for the pump, which means you only get the small amount of milk that sort of leaks out from the ducts into the milk sinuses under the areola.
Can you just ignore doctors and get with an IBCLC lactation consultant or two to help you out?
If you want more specific help let me know more data on your history and what you have done and not done and weights etc and I'll type a novel at you.
what is sllllooooooowwwwwww weight gain? Normal is 1/2-1 oz a day, 4-7 oz a week.
Sometimes all it takes is pushing one more feeding a day, esp if milk transfer is in a good range, which it is at 3 oz a feed.
Slow weight gain meaning she's still not back up to birth weight (born at 9lb, weighed 8lb 9oz at lactation appt on Thursday). Since she's been actually gaining weight she's managed to hit the low end of the "normal" range, about 4oz/wk. But I'm already feeding every 2 hours during the day and letting her go 3 hours at night. I feel like all I ever do is feed her and it's very discouraging that she's not packing on the lbs:(
Lots of little girls hit the 1/2oz a day weight gain range as their normal. really 1/2 oz a day is only 3.5 oz a week as the actual LOW normal. And remember low end of normal is still NORMAL weight gain.
I'm ready to throw in the towel. I'm going to try to see an LC in person this week because even after changing positions, self-expressing, etc. LO is still clamping down so hard I'm in so much pain I'm sobbing every time I nurse. It makes me angry at myself, resentful of LO, and generally overwhelmed. I'm experiencing a lot of symptoms of PPD, which I'm also seeking treatment for, and they all stem from the struggles of breastfeeding.
It's not YOU, It's something that the drs/LC's haven't been able to diagnose and fix what is going on with baby's latch. Get help in person and be a bit angry about it all, angry at them. it's not your fault and it's not baby's fault you are both learning. You need help to get this fixed so be angry at THEM not fixing it and push the to help you get this fixed. get help and keep pushing.
Yeah it is best to USE any milk you pump while you have thrush before you finish the treatment for thrush. The yeast spores can be in the milk you pump and basically "reinfect" yourself if you use frozen 'thrushy" milk later after you are clear from thrush.
However, yeast lives naturally on our skin. It's always there. The beneficial bacteria plus our good immune system keeps it in check. When our immune system is out of wack, sometimes right after labor, or for baby having an immature immune system, or if we have antibiotics that kills off beneficial bacteria, the yeast on our skin gets out of control and we get a yeast overgrowth. it happens with breastfeeding because yeast loves sugar, and breastmilk is sugary. so the yeast eats sugary breastmilk and pees basically alcohol which burns the nipple tissue and baby's mouth. This is further a problem if you get cracked and damaged nips casue it gives little cracks and crevices for the yeast to take hold and grow in a warm moist environment.
So once treatment for yeast is past, you still have some residual yeast living in you and baby's body, so if you give milk pumped while you had thrush, it's just a little bit extra yeast spores and shouldn't be a problem if everything is healthy in both of your systems. But yeast/thrush hurts, it can set baby off of wanting to eat, it burns nips, it's hard to get rid of, so lots of moms just feel it's too much of a risk to use "thrushy" pumped milk if you don't have to. In theory you could scald the milk like you do for high lipase and it should kill the yeast (heat kills yeast) but that's a pita.
Much easier is to not pump when you have thrush, or if you do, go ahead and use the milk if possible. If you freeze the milk pumped when you have thrush, mark the bag so you may want to use just a little bit of it at a time, spread out over months, when you are sure you have no lingering yeast/thrush issues.
Thanks so much for the detailed response! I will try to use it before we are done with the treatment to be safe.
Post by holliberry28 on Jul 13, 2015 18:24:24 GMT -5
sabrinaml and @ravinraven216, sorry you guys are struggling. I hope you get the help you need, whatever decision you make.
Had a pediatrician appointment. Told doctor he eats every hour from the breast and is constantly hungry but goes 3 hrs from pumped breast milk or formula. She said Im not making enough milk so I should supplement w formula after offering the breast for 10-15 min each feeding. It's so frustrating when I think I'll have enough for him off the breast, and then am told otherwise.
sabrinaml and @ravinraven216, sorry you guys are struggling. I hope you get the help you need, whatever decision you make.
Had a pediatrician appointment. Told doctor he eats every hour from the breast and is constantly hungry but goes 3 hrs from pumped breast milk or formula. She said Im not making enough milk so I should supplement w formula after offering the breast for 10-15 min each feeding. It's so frustrating when I think I'll have enough for him off the breast, and then am told otherwise.
Have you ever done a weighted feeding? I'd try to schedule one of those with an LC soon to see how much milk he's actually taking in at the breast. And if it's not much then the LC should be able to work with you on his latch or give you some tips on how to strengthen his suck!
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