WWPD/Advice? - Mediation on claiming kids on taxes

[bullybutt]

Long...

Ex and I are having to go to mediation because he is wanting to claim BOTH kids for 2014.  I am wanting to claim them both. DS is 2, DD is 6 months. I moved out in January of 2014.  I had my daughter in mid July.  We thought that we could possibly reconcile and I moved back at that end of Sept.  Mistake.  My dog was abused in November and went "missing" the very next day while I was gone to work.  I bought a house and got the F outta there.  Court stuff was semi-settled.  He is having to pay half of the medical bills for the kids (birth and checkup stuff) and he is having to pay half of childcare and some (currently unknown) child support starting Feb 1st. 

MY attorney thinks that each of us should claim one child.  I think it's bullshit and am seriously considering booting him.  Ex paid for daycare during my maternity leave for DS (10 weeks).  He did not pay for anything else while we weren't living together.  No birthdays, No Christmas, nothing.

Am I going to get reamed during mediation for thinking that it's bullshit for us to both claim one child?  Am I crazy sounding?

[sassypantzz]

I don't think you are out of line for FEELING that way, but I don't think you are going to win that battle.

[Deleted]

I would put together some spreadsheet and calculations to support your position. I don't think it's unreasonable, but I would compile the necessary supporting documentation to back you up.

What I don't get is approaching mediation with you already conceding to the middle ground - each of you claiming one child. I say go in saying you want to claim both, just as he is trying to do. And then work towards a common goal if need be.

Here's my tax take: you really want to be able to claim Head of Household status, rather than single. In order to do Head of Household you need at least one dependent. So I would absolutely fight against him getting to claim both.

[Deleted]

Jan 29, 2015 15:02:40 GMT -5 sassypantzz said:

I don't think you are out of line for FEELING that way, but I don't think you are going to win that battle.

this.  I would feel just as you feel, but I get the sense that neither of you will end up claiming both kids, and perhaps your attorney is just trying to make things settle more quickly and without much pain.

[Idani]

While no personal experience I do have many friends that are divorced and they each claim one child. I did have one friend that the year they were getting divorced had both children over 75% of the year solo so she claimed both kids. Her ex also didn't fight it which is why it probably happened. While I can see why you would be frustrated, I think the slip is likely the most common way. Sorry you are dealing with all this.

[kristhegirl]

The IRS website has a little quiz to walk you through who you can claim as a dependent - these aren't always super helpful but it may give you an idea of what you're up against.

[bullybutt]

So if he gets to claim one of them, shouldn't I get some sort of BACK child support for the time that we weren't together and he wasn't providing shit. Or is that just greedy bitch talk?

[mack]

The person who has primary physical custody is entitled to claim them unless there is another agreement made in court.

[mack]

How much is financially contributed is irrelevant when determining who gets to legally claim to kids (per the IRS). I will give you an example. The ratio of our child support decree for MH's older daughter has us responsible for 73% of child related costs. And we pay for medical insurance. However, because her mother has primary physical custody, she claims her. We could try and go back to get her to let us claim her some times, but she would most likely tell us to go fuck ourselves.

[runnergirl812]

Jan 29, 2015 15:14:11 GMT -5 mack said:

The person who has primary physical custody is entitled to claim them unless there is another agreement made in court.

This. And if you're 50/50, I could see each of you claiming one. I get why you want to claim at least one this year, but I think for a CA, going forward, it really should be based on the division of custody. Same thing with child support.

ETA: or at least it's how my bf's is set up. He has primary custody of the kids, and he claims them.

[divinemsbee]

I also agree that it depends on if you have primary physical custody or you're going to have a joint custody arrangement.

When my parents divorced they had completely joint physical and legal custody of us kids. The way they worked out who claimed whom for IRS purposes was that my mom claimed my brother and I (the older two)and my dad claimed my sister because that way he got to claim her longer. So, if it does come down to each of you only getting to claim one (and from what you've said I completely get why you'd want to get to claim both), it might be a good piece of advice to lobby for getting to claim the younger child because you'd be able to claim them longer.

I do agree that if you're going into mediation and he's going to fight to claim both, it's good to know that there is a common and possible compromise, but you don't need to/have to go in compromising already.

[bullybutt]

Well I don't care about forthcoming years since he will be paying child support and whatnot, but fuck man...last years also is bullshit. I also want answers to what happened to my dog. Hopefully he will finally fess the F up to that nightmare because I don't plan on letting it slide.

[mack]

I don't see him fessing up to that. He could face criminal charges if he did.

[runnergirl812]

At some point, the tax situation (long term) will be important. Don't get shortshrifted because you only care (now) about the present. Things like who pays for college, cars for the kids, medical, dental, insurance, custody, rules around leaving the state with the kids, vacations/holidays splits... it will ALL come back later and you do not want to have to go back to get it put in a CA or fight over it. Get your lawyers/mediator to hash it out now so you won't have get it put in later. The more detailed you are, the better. Believe me... it's important. Make it about the kids - not just to get back at your ex.

I hope you have a great lawyer. Ask lots of questions. I'm sorry about your dog. That's really shitty that that happened.

[bullybutt]

Jan 29, 2015 16:34:16 GMT -5 @gotgingy said:

What @lakermama66 said.

Don't let him run you over for shits and giggles. Make sure you get what you deserve. Don't settle for less than claiming one child every year. As long as he's got a legit job, the arrears will be taken care of without you having to stress.

He's self employed and does reno's on houses.  I am fully aware of my poor choice in a making babies with this sack of shit.

[bullybutt]

Jan 29, 2015 16:35:22 GMT -5 runnergirl812 said:

At some point, the tax situation (long term) will be important. Don't get shortshrifted because you only care (now) about the present. Things like who pays for college, cars for the kids, medical, dental, insurance, custody, rules around leaving the state with the kids, vacations/holidays splits... it will ALL come back later and you do not want to have to go back to get it put in a CA or fight over it. Get your lawyers/mediator to hash it out now so you won't have get it put in later. The more detailed you are, the better. Believe me... it's important. Make it about the kids - not just to get back at your ex.

I hope you have a great lawyer. Ask lots of questions. I'm sorry about your dog. That's really shitty that that happened.

There are good points here.  I will need to make a list of questions to take with me. 

[bullybutt]

Jan 29, 2015 16:43:34 GMT -5 @gotgingy said:

Jan 29, 2015 16:40:06 GMT -5 bullybutt said:

He's self employed and does reno's on houses.  I am fully aware of my poor choice in a making babies with this sack of shit.

What state are you in?  Some states are better than others about dealing with CS.  

Oklahoma

[jess9802]

I don't practice family law but one of my partners does. IIRC, what she says is this: IRS does not care what parents agree to do or what a state court says. The right to claim children as dependents, get the EITC, and claim other benefits turns solely on custody. If you have custody 183 nights a year, you are the custodial parent and have the right to claim these benefits. If your divorce judgment says it alternates, great, but the IRS is not bound by that. A violation of that would be a contempt issue between the parents.

OP, is your divorce final or is there a written separation agreement? HOH may not be available to you - regardless you will be better off with two dependents for personal exemptions and child tax credit.

[bullybutt]

Jan 30, 2015 0:34:22 GMT -5 jess9802 said:

I don't practice family law but one of my partners does. IIRC, what she says is this: IRS does not care what parents agree to do or what a state court says. The right to claim children as dependents, get the EITC, and claim other benefits turns solely on custody. If you have custody 183 nights a year, you are the custodial parent and have the right to claim these benefits. If your divorce judgment says it alternates, great, but the IRS is not bound by that. A violation of that would be a contempt issue between the parents.

OP, is your divorce final or is there a written separation agreement? HOH may not be available to you - regardless you will be better off with two dependents for personal exemptions and child tax credit.

@jess982, it's currently in the form of a temporary order.  We were never married.  I DO have custody for more than 183 nights out of the year.  We go to mediation next month.  Nothing was put in the temporary order regarding taxes. I am finding out that my lawyer is providing the bare minimum in regards to helping me.

[hedgehog]

Not a lawyer

I used to volunteer with a group that prepared income tax returns for low income families & senior citizens. One of the sticky areas we ran into was that in divorce/separations, if one parent already e-filed and claimed a kid as a dependent, the other spouse would be unable to submit an e-file with that kid- it bounced the return back, and would become a sticky mess. The professional accountants warned that it is very difficult to get amended, and definitely not in a timely manner. No clue if any of the cases were prosecuted for fraudulent dependent claims or whatever else though.

No advice, just a cautionary tale.

[runnergirl812]

Jan 30, 2015 15:17:32 GMT -5 hedgehog said:

Not a lawyer

I used to volunteer with a group that prepared income tax returns for low income families & senior citizens. One of the sticky areas we ran into was that in divorce/separations, if one parent already e-filed and claimed a kid as a dependent, the other spouse would be unable to submit an e-file with that kid- it bounced the return back, and would become a sticky mess. The professional accountants warned that it is very difficult to get amended, and definitely not in a timely manner. No clue if any of the cases were prosecuted for fraudulent dependent claims or whatever else though.

No advice, just a cautionary tale.

This actually happened to my parents/ brother. My brother and niece live with my parents full time. Because of this, my parents claim my niece, their granddaughter, on their taxes. One year, they found out that my nieces maternal grandmother had also filed with her SSN#. The result? My parents were audited and had to prove they actually had residential custody. Months later they finally got their refund but not until they had gone through the entire process of providing school records, and being interviewed by the IRS. Not pleasant for them at all. Not sure what penalty her other grandmother faced, but needless to say, my parents haven't talked to her since!!